An Obamacare Scare for Halloween

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 1:58 am » by Noentry


Cia212 wrote:@Noentry
Great if you like it. But don't fool yourself into thinking it's the best. Except in the equity of care, and British opinion polls - you guys definitely love your system.


@Thewatcher
Glad to hear it.

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I dont get fooled easily especially by stats that can be made up or misconstrued.
I found pleanty more for you.


Health rankings
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They show as a nation you spend more then the others and yet die earlier
Your infant mortality rate was quite a shock to me. WTF?
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 2:01 am » by Noentry


And do you know why this is?
I do.
Do you?

Would it be because you health system is first about profit and last about health.

Capitalism at its finest wouldn't you say Cia212?
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:01 am » by Cia212


Noentry wrote:
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They show as a nation you spend more then the others and yet die earlier
Your infant mortality rate was quite a shock to me. WTF?

You're quoting a discredited WHO study. There is no question that Americans have an unhealthy, even sedentary, lifestyle, and that contributes to a lower life expectancy. But that doesn't mean the healthcare system is worse. And compare the UK and US expenditure numbers - ours IS higher, and it's because there are more, newer, more expensive and more effective procedures available here than in the UK. Another way of saying that is the UK rations healthcare.

For those who actually care about their health and can afford it, the US is the place to be. And, without our evil capitalist system, the rest of the world might never get the procedures we are developing.

You're welcome.

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:14 am » by Noentry


Cia212 wrote:
Noentry wrote:
Image


They show as a nation you spend more then the others and yet die earlier
Your infant mortality rate was quite a shock to me. WTF?

You're quoting a discredited WHO study. There is no question that Americans have an unhealthy, even sedentary, lifestyle, and that contributes to a lower life expectancy. But that doesn't mean the healthcare system is worse. And compare the UK and US expenditure numbers - ours IS higher, and it's because there are more, newer, more expensive and more effective procedures available here than in the UK. Another way of saying that is the UK rations healthcare.

For those who actually care about their health and can afford it, the US is the place to be. And, without our evil capitalist system, the rest of the world might never get the procedures we are developing.

You're welcome.


Welcome to what exactly?

I already said statistics can be manipulated to show anything.

And after all you have said the reality is you as a nation, America spends more money then anyone else and are one of the the most unhealthiest in the world.

What do you say about your infant mortality rate? That surprised me.

Do you not agree with me on the fact that your health care predominately focuses on profit first and health second. It is the capitalist way is it not?

And you said Capitalism is evil not me.
I see both capitalism and communism as the same shit.
neither is right both doomed to fail.
Last edited by Noentry on Fri Nov 02, 2012 3:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

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User avatar
Posts: 8122
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2011 7:52 pm

PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:26 am » by Noentry


Cia212 wrote:
Noentry wrote:
Image


They show as a nation you spend more then the others and yet die earlier
Your infant mortality rate was quite a shock to me. WTF?

You're quoting a discredited WHO study. There is no question that Americans have an unhealthy, even sedentary, lifestyle, and that contributes to a lower life expectancy. But that doesn't mean the healthcare system is worse. And compare the UK and US expenditure numbers - ours IS higher, and it's because there are more, newer, more expensive and more effective procedures available here than in the UK. Another way of saying that is the UK rations healthcare.

For those who actually care about their health and can afford it, the US is the place to be. And, without our evil capitalist system, the rest of the world might never get the procedures we are developing.

You're welcome.


Discredited did you say.
By whom?

You mean the World Heath Organization is not to be trusted?
Who discredited them, I would like to see your link to the info please.
If this is true I will no longer use them, only if you can show me the info you have on them.
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

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Posts: 2309
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:34 pm

PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:34 am » by Cia212


Noentry wrote:
Cia212 wrote:
Noentry wrote:
Image


They show as a nation you spend more then the others and yet die earlier
Your infant mortality rate was quite a shock to me. WTF?

You're quoting a discredited WHO study. There is no question that Americans have an unhealthy, even sedentary, lifestyle, and that contributes to a lower life expectancy. But that doesn't mean the healthcare system is worse. And compare the UK and US expenditure numbers - ours IS higher, and it's because there are more, newer, more expensive and more effective procedures available here than in the UK. Another way of saying that is the UK rations healthcare.

For those who actually care about their health and can afford it, the US is the place to be. And, without our evil capitalist system, the rest of the world might never get the procedures we are developing.

You're welcome.


Welcome to what exactly?

For, not to, all of the innovation we give.

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:40 am » by Noentry


Cia in fairness your survival rates on cancer are impressive.
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How ever you spend twice the money as the UK

And only save 10% more people.
Still 10% is a good figure. :clapper:

However like I have said before we have PHS.
And it is just as good as the American Health System.
If you can afford it we have treatments that are the same as yours.
With the same outcome.

American cancer research is well funded but it is not a state secret or anything like that.
What you know is passed around the world.
The UK and America do not hide this type of info from one another.
The treatments are the same. The cures are the same.
:flop:


Edit.... oh I get it .
Then thank you is in order.
However research is not the same as a health service they are to different branches of the same tree.

You dont believe for one second if you had a NHS you would not excel in the survival rates.
This is not the reality of how research is funded, you would still have the same survival rates.
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

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Posts: 2309
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:34 pm

PostFri Nov 02, 2012 3:59 am » by Cia212


Noentry wrote:If you can afford it we have treatments that are the same as yours.
With the same outcome.

Not really, you have to come here for some things...like proton therapy.

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PostFri Nov 02, 2012 4:06 am » by Noentry


Cia212 wrote:
Noentry wrote:If you can afford it we have treatments that are the same as yours.
With the same outcome.

Not really, you have to come here for some things...like proton therapy.



Really? :headscratch:

Proton therapy is extraordinarily expensive. A proton facility costs $100M to $200M to construct, and costs of treatment range up to $100,000 per patient, twice as much as contemporary radiation therapy, and up to four times as much as surgery, brachytherapy, and other options. In some clinical situations, proton beam therapy is clearly superior than other alternatives, but such cases are rare. Proton beam treatment is therefore aggressively marketed--often using claims that are at best marginal, at worse false--to men with prostate cancer, for whom proton therapy has never been shown superior (or even equivalent) to other, less expensive treatments.[39] For this reason, Amitah Chandra, a health economist at Harvard University, has been quoted that "Proton-beam therapy is like the death star of American medical technology... It’s a metaphor for all the problems we have in American medicine.”


As of June 2012, there were a total of 41 proton therapy centers in Canada, China, England, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Korea, Poland, Russia, South Africa, Sweden, Switzerland, and USA;[41][42] and more than 83,667 patients had been treated.[43] One hindrance to universal use of the proton in cancer treatment is the size and cost of the cyclotron or synchrotron equipment necessary. Several industrial teams are working on development of comparatively small accelerator systems to deliver the proton therapy to patients.[44] Among the technologies being investigated are Superconducting synchrocyclotrons (also known as FM Cyclotrons), ultra-compact Synchrotrons and Dielectric wall accelerators


Not quite true Cia212.
:flop:
"The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority.
The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking."
A. A. Milne

Conspirator
Posts: 2309
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:34 pm

PostFri Nov 02, 2012 4:13 am » by Cia212


Noentry wrote:
Cia212 wrote:
Noentry wrote:If you can afford it we have treatments that are the same as yours.
With the same outcome.

Not really, you have to come here for some things...like proton therapy.



Really? :headscratch:

Not quite true Cia212.
:flop:

Funding has been approved but nhs.uk says it isn't available yet.

Given the complex nature of the treatment and facilities, Proton Beam Therapy won’t be fully available in England until 2017.


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