Are we really this stupid???

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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 9:57 am » by Hesop


OK, I see now. Thanks for that. That follows what I've believed the larger problem to be. Which is the industries supporting, or contributing to illegals in the workforce. They have a small number of employees that are documented, but a larger number that are not. And like organized crime, it is the documented ones that get paid a little more, because they help in supplying the undocumented ones.
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:13 am » by Torofamily


so now that the mix up was clarified what can one individual do?
how do we create change?


anybody?
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:20 am » by Daemonfoe


hesop wrote:OK Low, you just confused me. So, if you could help clear this up.

It is well known America is dependent on cheap imported labor in several fields.
However, my confusion here is the combining of your post, with Doms, in the effect that Doms specifies illegal aliens. Then, lending the assumption that we could retain the legal ones for the service necessary and not suffer the losses. Is your info centered in on illegals as well? Leaving out legal card holders? That would imply that there are some pretty good numbers, involving the industries supportive stance on illegal labor as well.

Not questioning your research, just clarification in wording.
I was thinking the exact same thing.

It is true that most Americans wouldn't want to do a lot of the dirty work, but you have to ask yourself why wouldn't we? What can be done to bring Americans humility? It hasn't always been this way.
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:28 am » by Hesop


torofamily wrote:so now that the mix up was clarified what can one individual do?
how do we create change?


anybody?


Probably the only thing we could do, is try harder to encourage lawmakers to increase oversight in the industry and aggressively tackle any companies that fail to adhere to the policies in force. But that's beating a dead horse, as these same companies furnish college scholarships to the congressman's kids, and contribute big bucks to their campaigns. It would seem the only companies fined, are non contributors, or contributors to the other party.
Claussens, the famous pickle company, near Chicago, even has their own fleet of vans, to go out and bring these illegals to their jobs in the factory. No Caucasians are allowed in the work area, without one of their white lab type jackets on. If someone did anyway, the entire workforce would go running out the back door, believing them to be immigration officials.

So, I guess the question is still open.
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:37 am » by Wompasdub


Our families were all imigrants once whether they came through in the early 1900s or have been here as colonists. I'm pretty tired of all the damn xenophobia in this country. Lets just kill them all, inject them with candy hang them over a tree and whack them with a stick at our kid's birthday parties. Problem solved

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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:49 am » by Eyeswideopen121


you don't see the bigger picture! the american government has been supporting immigration since the 1840's and the Irish famines when 3 million Irish left for a better life! now your complaining about not even half a trillion being spent on human lives being improved! the war is what is crippling the economy without war nobody would go hungry
stuck up american bastard have some respect for your fellow man. I would like to see how you would like it if you had to deal with any real problems

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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:50 am » by Hesop


daemonfoe wrote:I was thinking the exact same thing.

It is true that most Americans wouldn't want to do a lot of the dirty work, but you have to ask yourself why wouldn't we? What can be done to bring Americans humility? It hasn't always been this way.


It's true, most won't Daemon, but I do. On more than one occasion when asked by someone to do a specific job, I'll ask them why they don't do it themselves. If I don't get a good answer, I'll just double my price. It's hard as hell to get bailed hay in out of the fields here, simply because actual work is involved. It makes my ass hurt, to be working with a couple of young healthy guys in their 20's, and they fail to keep up with me, and I'm 52. Most of the time, we have to just take longer and do it all short handed, because if it's labor involved, no one seems to want to answer their phone. When branding comes up, forget it. It's just smaller ranchers like ourselves helping each other out. Younger guys in town, needing money won't even bother. A little shit splatter on their pants, or calf snot on their hands, and they head for home. They even act scared to death of even a very small calf.

I teach my son, by example, and he helps out with no complaints with anything asked. That's the best we can do.
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 10:55 am » by Hesop


eyeswideopen121 wrote:you don't see the bigger picture! the american government has been supporting immigration since the 1840's and the Irish famines when 3 million Irish left for a better life! now your complaining about not even half a trillion being spent on human lives being improved! the war is what is crippling the economy without war nobody would go hungry
stuck up american bastard have some respect for your fellow man. I would like to see how you would like it if you had to deal with any real problems

Which individual would be the stuck up american bastard?
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 11:37 am » by Hesop


eyeswideopen121 wrote:you don't see the bigger picture! the american government has been supporting immigration since the 1840's and the Irish famines when 3 million Irish left for a better life! now your complaining about not even half a trillion being spent on human lives being improved! the war is what is crippling the economy without war nobody would go hungry
stuck up american bastard have some respect for your fellow man. I would like to see how you would like it if you had to deal with any real problems

First off, I do have respect for my fellow man, no matter what religion he follows.
If I didn't have that respect, I would be calling you a prejudiced dumbass.
Maybe next time you choose to hit and run, you might stop by, and explain what lives are being improved, as compared to which ones are being exploited!
Tens of THOUSANDS of our jobs were GIVEN to Mexico under NAFTA. There is a whole new city there made up of American Companies. Paying mexican citizens $20 per week, for the same jobs that paid at least 10 to 12$ per HOUR here. The Mexicans are working 6, 10 to 12 hr days for that. The companies profits went up. But the prices of their products did not drop with the labor savings.
I am certain then, that you would be completely comfortable, working twice as many hours, for less than half the pay of the person next to you.
You should then too, quit your job and advise your employers to find an illegal to replace you at half your pay. It would bring you so much joy, knowing you helped improve someone elses life, by letting your greedy boss exploit them in the process.
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PostTue Sep 01, 2009 11:43 am » by Aragajag


hesop wrote:
eyeswideopen121 wrote:you don't see the bigger picture! the american government has been supporting immigration since the 1840's and the Irish famines when 3 million Irish left for a better life! now your complaining about not even half a trillion being spent on human lives being improved! the war is what is crippling the economy without war nobody would go hungry
stuck up american bastard have some respect for your fellow man. I would like to see how you would like it if you had to deal with any real problems

First off, I do have respect for my fellow man, no matter what religion he follows.
If I didn't have that respect, I would be calling you a prejudiced dumbass.
Maybe next time you choose to hit and run, you might stop by, and explain what lives are being improved, as compared to which ones are being exploited!
Tens of THOUSANDS of our jobs were GIVEN to Mexico under NAFTA. There is a whole new city there made up of American Companies. Paying mexican citizens $20 per week, for the same jobs that paid at least 10 to 12$ per HOUR here. The Mexicans are working 6, 10 to 12 hr days for that. The companies profits went up. But the prices of their products did not drop with the labor savings.
I am certain then, that you would be completely comfortable, working twice as many hours, for less than half the pay of the person next to you.
You should then too, quit your job and advise your employers to find an illegal to replace you at half your pay. It would bring you so much joy, knowing you helped improve someone elses life, by letting your greedy boss exploit them in the process.


In Australia we have had the same thing with Asia, they cant justify the costs of employment here but can pack up all the tools and go set up overseas and make so much more money. I am not anti Asian at all, they are doing the best they can with what they have, what gets me is the greed and hypocrisy, like you said the prices still stay the same.
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