Crop Formations...Why not set up a camera?

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PostThu Sep 13, 2012 12:32 am » by Iwanci

Warngen, your contributions are most welcome my friend and you should post more often.

Cog, I hear whatr you are saying mate, however we need to draw the line in the sand on some things. Seems to me that you may be a little biased in your statements (not meaning any disrespect as I too may seem biased due to me beliefs). If we are analysing any situation which we do not understand we must set some parameters.
It is not right for example to put into question that one investigator obtains their information from secondary sources and state that this as being less valid than the ‘other’ sides research which has likewise been gathered from secondary sources.

I take your points on your own personal experiences my friend, and whilst I was not there to witness what you experienced I cannot provide anything of real value here other than to say that I think there are other factors which may explain some of what you experienced. It is well documented that many people experience sensations that they cannot explain or ‘feelings’ that are out of the ordinary when they ‘believe’ that something paranormal is being experienced, for example some people are participate in séances or visit haunted houses and they experience very strange sensations which they swear is a result of the paranormal, they continue to think this way even after they are made aware that it was a set experiment and there was nothing paranormal.. my point is that you can lead yourself to conclusions, a placebo effect of sorts. Not suggesting this is what happened to you, but without knowing the full situation, difficult for any outsider to simply believe there was anything other than ‘normal’ reactions at play.

Also, you state that the ‘aliens’ cannot be expected to think like us humans think, and yet you believe that they have the foresight to understand the complexity and delicacy of their interaction with us, and so they are deliberately cryptic in their messages so as to not cause our belief system into total upheaval? So in one sentence they do not know how we think and in another they implicitly understand the delicate nature of our thought processes? Nope, this is an each way bet my friend, either they don’t understand us or they do. You must take a stance in an argument and build you case in that direction, unless of course you are not totally convinced either way and are open enough to state that you don’t truly know and so you keep an open mind to the endless possibilities.

Great discussions my friends and the true meaning of DTV = open, honest, tolerance and the occasional heated opinions.
Fortes fortuna iuvat

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PostThu Sep 13, 2012 12:22 pm » by Cognoscenti

@iwanci: A few points to clarify our discussion/debate:
1) I recognize that testimony of personal experience which cannot be objectified by a third party is the weakest form of evidence. That is why I have never til now in all my CC threads described my personal experiences. But if you saw a disc shaped craft in broad daylight, hovering silently and stationary 50 feet over your head in broad daylight, then watched it silently zoom to the horizon in 2 seconds you would have no evidence to provide anyone else of the truth of your experience, but I guarantee the experience would change you.
2) The failure of my camera in a CC was not a personal physiological experience. Videos do exist of malfunctioning of electronic equipment in CCs such as fluctuating altitude readings, EMF readings, GPS readings, electronic compass readings, etc confined to the area within crop circles. I am sure you are aware that these kind of reports are common and frequent from visitors to genuine crop circles, and are obviously anomalous.
3) I think you misunderstand my comment on the nature of the behavior of an advanced non-human intelligence. I believe they DO understand human thought and psychology, but the way they react, respond and interact with us cannot necessarily be in a mannner that we as humans would think or act.

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PostFri Sep 14, 2012 6:23 am » by Iwanci

Cog, no doubt that an experience (any experience) that lends itself to ones personal belief has a very powerful and profound effect on the individual. This is due to the association we place with the event and the effect is amplified if in fact it lends itself to the belief rather than opposing it.

I am in no way suggesting that what you experienced is anything other than what you believe you experienced, I wasn't there afterall. I am however suggesting that there may have been alternative explanations to the events.

The camera malfunctioning I cannot explain, however, the effect of this malfunction on your thought process was probably apmplified by the nature of the experience. You did visit a crop circle, you did already have a preconception of what you were likely to experience and so your mind more than likely made the connection, in fact it may have magnified the results for you. Had you, for example, been an unwitting participant in this event, ie, had you been simply walking through a field without expectation and without preconception (totally oblivious) to what you were to encounter, the camera malfunction may not have registered in your mind as pronounced as it did, ie, you may have simply seen it as a glitch, which in fact it may have been.

I find stories from personal experience to be extremely valid, proof or no proof. I place great significance on stories told first hand by those who had the experience. Your story facinates me mate.

Yet again, I wasn't there my friend so cannot and do not wish to deny what you experienced, if, after YOU analyse your own experience without bias, you believe strongly in what you saw etc, then I will be compelled to accept your story. It is not for me nor anyone else to accept or reject your experience.

Now the aliens, what do we really know about their knowledge? what do we know about what they know of us, our communication style, our political or religious complexity, our society, our mentality etc? Truth is we do not know what we do not know. To say that they are being careful in the way the communicate with us is fanciful at best. To say they are complex beings who are carefully and slowly passing on messages so as to not upset the apple cart on earth is likewise fanicful. To state anything as fact on a topic where no one truly knows anything is indeed crazy talk. I appreciate this is not what you are saying.

The fact for me remains that no one (including me) knows anything about aliens, nor do we know if they actually even exist. Everything we believe is based purely on conjecture and speculation and wishful thinking. Having said that, how nice would it be if it were true? Keeping in mind that with so many different thoughts on the topic, they can't all be correct. So your crazy assed ideas are just as valid as my crazy assed ideas.

On another note, I like your style Cog.

Fortes fortuna iuvat


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