Lenard Walson and Gridkeeper "astrophotography" HOAX !!!

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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 8:55 am » by Lowsix


I have seen tons and tons of assertions questioning the validity of GKs and JLWs materials, but I haven't seen one shred of proof that they are hoaxes. I have no opinion either way, and will refrain from holding one until as you wish, he either releases his methods or others are able to replicate it.

I will not accept blind accusations toward myself that Im a supporter of his, or that I am either one of them registered under new accounts. That behavior is highly paranoid and delusional, and does nothing but detract from the real efforts of research being put into this subject on all levels. IP sniff away.

This part is simply a question..in the first post of the thread, it is stated that Gridkeeper was actually Banned from this forum for supporting JLW despite the 'assertions" from this forum and ATS that all this was a hoax.

Why?

Does neither forum allow questioning or countering wildly slung premises put forward by admins?

How does music added to video prove a hoax?

Does this reasoning apply to Jaime Maussan's research and video presentations because they rely so heavily on New Age Scores?

There is no way for anyone to PROVE that this person Gridkeeper is the person referred to in Walsons videos.

There is no way to prove that JLW added his own name to the circulating stolen videos. It would be laughably easy for someone to take window movie maker and add credits in ANYONE's name that they so choose(in an effort to prove that he's stealing footage).

You simply cannot prove origin by names taken of people registering in internet forums. Nor can you verify their claims of "i know so and so, therefore I am who I say I am" unlesss JLW came here himself and agreed, and even then you would have no way to verify that the person claiming to be him, WAS him.
No, IP sniffing doesn't count.

I could make the case that the fonts used on what you are calling his Stolen videos of 'bambi's" materials do not match the fonts used in the FAST materials. Nor do they exhibit the exacting unusual placement on positioning of copyright symbols. Yes, they cover the body of the video, but by analysis, they are not similar. And even if they did, you cannot by any wild stretch of the imagination prove the person of origin, other than your contact to the person registered HERE as gridkeeper.

These are all technically 'assertions" and do not by ANY stretch of investigative imagination constitute Proof of anything, much less proof that the original materials were hoaxed.

Not that they are NOT hoaxed, but the weight of what is leveled as proof is EXTREMELY lacking, in a true Chain of possession manner that would be required PROOF as you claim.

Debunking requires not that the originator defends himself necessarily (yes it is certainly helpful) but more importantly the burden of proof falls to the accuser.

I have not seen any duplication of videos like his showing a faked method, or of any videos of moon footage that even come close to approaching the details present in his video. The accuser is burdened to prove (if they are allowed to use the word) how the footage was faked. The fact that he wont provide you the means to debunk his own videos doesn't constitute a debunk. Burden again, is on the accuser. Ive seen nothing ever approaching a debunk of his methods, or replication, if they are so easily faked by him.

Just TONS ad hominem and unsupported and basically unverifiable assertions.
That won't pass muster in any serious examination of the words "Proven Hoax".

This by no stretch is to be construed as 'flaming, or attack, or trolling".
This IS however a valid counter-questioning to what Im seeing as very weak evidence being constituted as "final pronouncement" and under the real spirit of legitimate inquiry concerning your means, low quality of proof, and poor chain of creation/posession...this line of questioning is 100% valid.
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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 9:26 am » by Hesop


Burden is on the accuser?? Are you a freaking loon??
Go back to school, and learn how science and discoveries are governed!!

Give it a break, and get a life.
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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 9:45 am » by Hesop


Do you really believe you are the only one here that has registered under more than one name, or knows how to use IP software? I know of several.
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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 9:47 am » by Lowsix


Give what a break and get a life?
Dont ask questions? Or dont dare question your methods of "proof" that its a hoax?
Or dont DARE counter the forum vets? what is it exactly?

Lol really man?
what is that dude?
All i did was ask some really basic questions.

When a cop accuses someone of a crime, GENERALLY he has to be able to prove it or provide evidence that the Prosecutor will accept, or else..drum roll..CHARGES cant be filed.

Burden is on the accuser, particularly if the accused isnt participating..

And yeah, if youre going to run around claiming you've busted someone cold, you need better evidence than what is being claimed as evidence.

Youre debunking people thru a forum using way unsupportable conjecture about someones mental health based on what some OTHER guy said, who CLAIMS hes this certain person. That isnt proof of anything. Claiming videos are stolen by him when anyone could type his name on them..

We're talking some basic common sense.

And based the the attitude i get from a fairly respectful counter inquiry, no wonder he wouldnt feel like inviting you into his home to share anything.

ALSO, i said that i didnt have a position either way.
Theres no break to give.

Insulting me isnt going to make any sort of point really.
Everything I put forward is reasonable given you dont have JLW participating...

Im not bowing to your status quo dude, sorry.
Im asking questions..sorry if that bothers you.
You claim to "prove" something, I need evidence.
I dont see any.
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warløckmitbladderinfection wrote:blasphemous new gehenna inhabitant makes god sad...

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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 9:48 am » by Lowsix


First time registration, first post ever, here.

sry.
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warløckmitbladderinfection wrote:blasphemous new gehenna inhabitant makes god sad...

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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 10:31 am » by Hesop


Burden is not on any accuser in science "dude". I have not made any claims that his shit is hoaxed. I have watched his postings from the beginning. The deal that surrounds this info, is instead of providing answers, all that is given is bullshit. People are sick and f :censored: king tired of this ignorant bullshit. Don't you get that? Every now and then, another name shows up trying to ignorantly argue the case, without complying to simple procedures accepted all over the planet that apply to SCIENCE, not police work.

What kind of astonomer, would post his claim to finding a new planet, and not expect to have to provide the data, so that the claim can be VERIFIED, by having other ACCREDITED astronomers produce the SAME results? One with NO credibility! What exactly is it about this you fail to comprehend? Case closed. Plenty of time has elapsed, to allow procedures to be met. People are sick of these feeble arguments. Only a drama queen would continue to pursue this cause.

And what of these arguements anyways? A sane person would argue that these craft are really there. That would be the cause of the arguement, that the world could be under a threat. NOT about someones notoriety. That's just plain juvenile. You're beating a dead horse. I'm done with it. Read what all the credible astronomers say on this topic. Not hard to do.
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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 10:59 am » by Lowsix


You're wound a bit tight i see.

1. You say youre arent claiming its a hoax. Fair enough.
So why get so hysterical over the valid questions I put forward?
Why start the insult game on my first post, if you arent emotionally invested.
Im not. I dont care one way or the other.
I can (and will) ask questions, however.

Im not dealing with whether its hoaxed or not becuase I simpy couldnt prove it either way, with my limited resources. Same applies to everyone claiming they have "PROVEN" (keyword PROVEN) that he is a hoaxer.. Im not defending him or his videos.
Im saying that based on what you (or the forums accusing him) KNOW..as fact, about the guy..they cant pretend to say definitively that it all hoaxed Thats simple, and its not a dead horse if you're willing to go hostile over some simple relevant questions.

2. He is not participating, for better or worse..that is the fact.
That doesnt prove anything, although it makes the case for it.
We are talking Proof.

It makes it highly suspicious (yes, omg even to me) that he wont provide methods or coordinates. The fact that he doesnt, implies a hoax, but certainly doesnt prove it.
If you arent making the claim, fine, then why are you climbing all over me? Thats paranoid, suspicious, trollish and immature.

What is going on here falls way short of science.
In the absence of his participation, the accusers actually do assume the burden.
That may be distateful to you, but it is true.

If he doesnt participate, then those accusing STILL have to use means and methods that could reliably prove his hoaxes (or even the simple matter of his or gridkeepers identity). If they cannot do any of the above, they cant use the word 'prove'. And they cant. Period. Show me an exact replica how hes hoaxing the craft. Show me an approximation of how hes taking the moon shots. I haven't seen any.

You cant use a registration in some anonymous internet forum to ascertain identity.
You can trace route, you can sniff an IP, but neither proves anything..
Location doesnt equal identity. Using a nickname doesnt prove identity.

Anyone could put his name on those stolen videos.
That is a fact.

The fonts dont match his other videos. Thats a fact.

You cant prove that the person registered in this forum as gridkeeper, is the gridkeper JLW mentions. That is a fact.
He can claim it, still wont make it fact.

You can accuse every new poster that asks questions around here of being this same person/set of people. Your paranoia doesnt make that a fact. Period.

While there may be multiple people using multiple identities, not all new posters are combinations of those, and you cant prove that they are.
Thats a fact.

Im neither of those guys.
Critical thought can go both ways, and should.

Im not challenging you, unless youre emotionally tied to the outcome.
You seem to be or you wouldnt be personally insutling me.

The best that can be said, is that its highly likely that hes hoaxing, until he participates or someone can replicate his images with a trick of their own as well as matching his moon shots.

He cant spell the word 'here"..I dont think anyone is accusing him of being an astronomer.

Till then..all conjecture.
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warløckmitbladderinfection wrote:blasphemous new gehenna inhabitant makes god sad...

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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 12:22 pm » by Hesop


To give an answer to my insultive nature here, then consider for a moment logical assumption. Your first post here, directly after register, is to dig up an older post selectively, and most exclusively for response. In your response, you display a pretty damn good knowledge of the conflicts and drama, long carried out in this case, which , of course, stretches out across several websites over a period of time. You made some mentions of information I was not aware of. But in almost every case, the arguement supported by his colleges or groupies has been the same, and spread amongst all the other sites as well. Knowing then, the continued arguement, and attempts to place burden elsewhere other than comply with protocol, you chose to continue it further here. It is easily then assumable, that you could likely be just another username by a same individual. Yet while that may not be the case, why would anyone that has already witnessed the ongoing drama, that, as you say, is missing a participant, and therefore cannot be adequately tested, be so eager to raise it from the depths yet again? By mere curiosity? My emotional interest is only tied to this site. Trolls, and instigators seem to be on the rise in the winter, when more teens are stuck indoors and merely seek other means of excitement. So you see, there are 2 sides to all stories. Maybe now you may better understand mine.
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PostWed Mar 04, 2009 8:40 pm » by Lowsix


Did you know..

That on the disclose tv main page, where most of us go to view the videos, that on the upper left hand corner there is a box that in RED letters, states.."HOT forum topics"?
And that on several of the days preceding my registration, THIS thread appeared there, under the Hot Forum Topic listing?

And then, please note that of the preceding NINE entries prior to my registration, the oldest was March First?

Now on what planet does responding to posts a whopping three days old constitutes "digging up an older post selectively, and most exclusively for response." or "be so eager to raise it from the depths yet again? By mere curiosity?"

what depths?
Digging older posts Selectively?

Um, no..the content was pushed at me by the code on the front page by its charming little red letters that read "hot"... generally meaning current and/or active, and then a date check of nine prior posts gives me march 01.

So in one single day, you have called me a loon, told me to give (an active thread) a break, questioned my intelligence, told me to get a life (for asking 100% relevant questions), accused me of being an imposter and IP spoofer, and accused me of being JLW or The Gridkeeper.

Those sorts of nutty, unfounded, delusional, paranoid assumptions from forums like these are what give this research and it's participants such a bad name, and make its contributers the objects of derision and ridicule. These types of Forums pretend to be pushing free thought, and critical thinking while awash with foaming-mouth hostility and paranoia and relentless ad hominem attacks...attacking ANY divergence from the koolaid-drinking cult mentality of the 'community' status quo (which has taken upon itself to mightily proclaim what is real and what is not). Brilliant strategy.

The NM water table is drowning in psychoactive and psychotropic chemicals, weapon system waste products and radioactivity---all proven to cause paranoia, delusions, and unprovoked violence. I lived there twenty years and left because of people like you.

Get off me.
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warløckmitbladderinfection wrote:blasphemous new gehenna inhabitant makes god sad...

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PostThu Apr 09, 2009 8:00 pm » by Gridkeepertruth


Nice to see that I'm banned from logging into this forum under the name gridkeeper yet am able to log into the main disclose tv page. That's not very clever is it now.
Also I've been banned from posting responses at the badastronomy forum after being invited there to defend myself. That's the second time it happend, the first was an accident from a moderator who let me back on to post. Once a load of lies and disinfo had been written about me I was blocked from even logging in. This happend at the same time as it did with this forum. Crazy.

Check out these moon videos. If anyone wants to slag me off or slander me for posting these then be my guest, they speak for themselves. Now the quality for the youtube conversion isn't too bad. They don't play on youtube as true HD so you can imagine exactly how good these shots are in HD. The Clavius film is the clearest one of the three.

Filmed through an LX90 12" Meade in the UK during Moon Week UK 2009.

Moon filmed In Infrared - Area Near Clavius - Moon Week 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJeDsYXXM2Q


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Lunar Ray Crater Copernicus filmed from Earth for Moon Week 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvVfmAhoZSk


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Clavius Moon Crater filmed from Earth for Moon Week UK 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaV-1j3ChLA


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