Lucifer and The Aztecs

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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 7:22 pm » by Spock


Actually, the term "Morning Star" doesn't have to be singular, only referring to either/or. There is another verse in the OT, (from the KJ version) Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

When the scripture referred to Lucifer as the morning star, it doesn't mean he was the only morning star. It would be like calling you, Megame or Oto, son of man, or human, or philosopher or ponderer, etc.

Anyone can be a "morning star" as by definition the way it was used, it meant someone (or some things) light that shown brighter than other light - as in the Job verse above.

Understanding it like this, there is no reason to believe that all versions except the KJ are wrong.

Plus, like Jesus said, see the heart of it, and not the letter - following legalistically is not the heart of the message of Christianity/Jesus.

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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 8:04 pm » by Megame23


i disagree on bible versions Spock, have you ever looked into Wescott and Hort?

the texts that Erasmus put together were used for the Authorized version of the bible(KJV) Erasmus knew of and rejected texts like the Vaticanus.

the Vaticanus is a text controlled by the Vatican, pretty much no one is allowed to even see the real manuscript. this Vatican text is the primary text used in the texts put together by Wescott and Hort. the text they used second most was the Sinaticus.

(these men themselves were also occultists.)

what are the Vaticanus and Sinaticus?

they are large portions of biblical texts, with some books, chapters, verses, words, omitted or added.

for example there are over 3000 places where these texts contradict eachother in the 4 gospels alone.


ok so wescott and hort come along and put togehter their own manuscripts and say that they ahve put together the best and most acurate of all the biblical manuscripts.

the work of these men has now become the standard greek text used when creating bible translations.



the texts that the bible is translated from is different in the KJV than in other versions. theres a lot more to it than that but here are some verse examples to show you some of the problems with newer versions.

1 timothy 3:16

KJV

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

NIV

Beyond all question, the mystery of godliness is great: He appeared in a body, was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory.


lots of people beleive jesus appeared in a body... but it was God was manifest in the flesh.


Hosea 11:12

KJV

Ephraim compasseth me about with lies, and the house of Israel with deceit: but Judah yet ruleth with God, and is faithful with the saints.

NIV

Ephraim has surrounded me with lies, the house of Israel with deceit. And Judah is unruly against God, even against the faithful Holy One.


are they faithful or are they against God? those dont seem to be the same...


2 Samuel 21:19

KJV

And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.

NIV

In another battle with the Philistines at Gob, Elhanan son of Jaare-Oregim the Bethlehemite killed Goliath the Gittite, who had a spear with a shaft like a weaver's rod.


who killed Goliath?



here Spock, listen to this mans testimony please:


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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 8:13 pm » by Zer0


spock wrote:Actually, the term "Morning Star" doesn't have to be singular, only referring to either/or. There is another verse in the OT, (from the KJ version) Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

When the scripture referred to Lucifer as the morning star, it doesn't mean he was the only morning star. It would be like calling you, Megame or Oto, son of man, or human, or philosopher or ponderer, etc.

Anyone can be a "morning star" as by definition the way it was used, it meant someone (or some things) light that shown brighter than other light - as in the Job verse above.

Understanding it like this, there is no reason to believe that all versions except the KJ are wrong.

Plus, like Jesus said, see the heart of it, and not the letter - following legalistically is not the heart of the message of Christianity/Jesus.


So how does Christianity explain the whole Quetzalcoatl thing? Dont go Mormom on me and tell me that Quetzalcoatl was actually Jesus paying a visit to the Aztecs... :roll:
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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 8:22 pm » by Spock


otoel wrote:So how does Christianity explain the whole Quetzalcoatl thing? Dont go Mormom on me and tell me that Quetzalcoatl was actually Jesus paying a visit to the Aztecs... :roll:



There's no need for a "Christian" explanation, even though it would be great to know.

We live in a mystery, man will never have the capacity, in his current form, to understand everything that he even thinks he understands now. That is why I get a kick rolling my eyes at so many people that "have it all figured out" on this forum.

Hopefully one day all these things will be revealed.

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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 8:28 pm » by Zer0


spock wrote:
otoel wrote:So how does Christianity explain the whole Quetzalcoatl thing? Dont go Mormom on me and tell me that Quetzalcoatl was actually Jesus paying a visit to the Aztecs... :roll:



There's no need for a "Christian" explanation, even though it would be great to know.

We live in a mystery, man will never have the capacity, in his current form, to understand everything that he even thinks he understands now. That is why I get a kick rolling my eyes at so many people that "have it all figured out" on this forum.

Hopefully one day all these things will be revealed.


I dont want all things to be revealed mang, I just want to be sure of atleast one thing, know what I mean??
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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 8:44 pm » by Phaeton


Megame, your unwavering belief the 'KJV project' is the complete and untampered truth is remarkable.
Why do you believe this with such conviction.. without going into the specifics; you must know he was of Tudor descent. You obviously know the role of royalty through time.. You know the popularity of the KJV and the fact almost anything mainstream is allowed to be mainstream. And if something has that status, one can be quite sure it has been adopted in such a way it does not hold any threat. So for you to be so very sure this KJV is pure and unmanipulated seems illogical to me.. Whats your logic on that?
"Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who could not hear the music"
"All our science measured against reality, is primitive and childlike - yet, in contemporary consensus, its the most precious thing we have"


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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 9:08 pm » by Megame23


phaeton im going on vacation tomorrow and dont feel like getting into this debate at the moment. but here is a great presentation on this topic


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(not saying i agree with her on everything, but she has done some great research, very good lecture.)


as for King James himself, he had nothing to do with translating that bible, nor did the bible have his name attacked to it untill long after. it was the Authorized version, King James simply said something like, 'yes you can make that version good plan', it wasn't even his idea to have it made. the scholars used NON corrupt, NON Vatican manuscripts, they used the work of Erasmus.

i know that there is all sorts of lies out there to discredit him also. Fact is, King James threw the secret societies out of England when he held power, and he also wrote a Deamonology on occultism and how to fight against it. He was a good king, and the Jesuits tried to murder him (Gunpowder plot) Guy Fawkes and this plot are celebrated now in things like V for Vendetta, in which the satanist Alan Moore acts as if Fawkes was a hero fighting against tyranny. the 5th of November was remember by people, to celebrate the fact that King James lived through the attempt. the people would burn guy Fawkes dolls.


The Authorized version, the texts put together by Erasmus, and the works of the strong Christians who fought to get us the bible we have today, and to get us away from the catholic church. Ill trust in what these guys did, rather than in the works of occultists like Wescott and Hort, and the texts that the pope a corrupted so called 'christian' organizations push on people now.


cya guys in a week or so :D
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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 9:17 pm » by Zer0


Nice hit and run megame, all you have accomplished in this thread is make yourself like a delusional fool and you insulted my own knowledge on a topic you have no background on... How about instead of a week we see ya on a month? Ye hope you enjoy your ban punk.
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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 9:18 pm » by Harbin


Ephiasians 5:11,
And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.

kjv
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PostSat Jul 09, 2011 9:34 pm » by Phaeton


megame23 wrote:phaeton im going on vacation tomorrow and dont feel like getting into this debate at the moment. but here is a great presentation on this topic


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(not saying i agree with her on everything, but she has done some great research, very good lecture.)


as for King James himself, he had nothing to do with translating that bible, nor did the bible have his name attacked to it untill long after. it was the Authorized version, King James simply said something like, 'yes you can make that version good plan', it wasn't even his idea to have it made. the scholars used NON corrupt, NON Vatican manuscripts, they used the work of Erasmus.

i know that there is all sorts of lies out there to discredit him also. Fact is, King James threw the secret societies out of England when he held power, and he also wrote a Deamonology on occultism and how to fight against it. He was a good king, and the Jesuits tried to murder him (Gunpowder plot) Guy Fawkes and this plot are celebrated now in things like V for Vendetta, in which the satanist Alan Moore acts as if Fawkes was a hero fighting against tyranny. the 5th of November was remember by people, to celebrate the fact that King James lived through the attempt. the people would burn guy Fawkes dolls.


The Authorized version, the texts put together by Erasmus, and the works of the strong Christians who fought to get us the bible we have today, and to get us away from the catholic church. Ill trust in what these guys did, rather than in the works of occultists like Wescott and Hort, and the texts that the pope a corrupted so called 'christian' organizations push on people now.


cya guys in a week or so :D


Am I to understand Catholics dont use the KJV, given it is based on non Vatican manuscripts? And if they do use the KJV - which ofcourse they do - what is differentiating the Roman Catholic version with that of 'King James'? And furthermore; how do you know the KJV from 1611 had thesame content as a KJV from the shops today?

What is your opinion on the Byzantine texts in comparison to the Greek?
"Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who could not hear the music"
"All our science measured against reality, is primitive and childlike - yet, in contemporary consensus, its the most precious thing we have"


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