Nihilgeist wrote:Vulcanic wrote:
long ago MAN took the wolf in and learned how to breed different dogs for different jobs by looking for certain traits in them,, samoyed tribe could not live without there dogs, they hunt for them they are used as sled dogs and many other things. these are not wild animals these are animals that we created and there dependent on us to some extent.
as man learned everything he knew from animals, how to hunt, fishing
Do our dogs have consciousness (self-awareness)
This is one of the oldest arguments in science, but today's Wall Street Journal has an interesting article about the latest research on animal behavior which is leading more and more scientists to speculate that everything from household pets to monkeys, chimps and dolphins may have the basic components of what constitutes consciousness.
Great video! if they keep it up for a very long time they can make new breeds of fox never seen before breed tallest with tallest or small with small, long nose with long nose or short nose with short nose , ear up or down tail fluffy or not given enough time to find the rare ones and breeding those in the end you'll end up with something that you would never know was a fox.
Fatdogmendoza wrote:Some fish will die for humans and even help them...Just look at dolphins....
Im surprised no thick fuck has come up with that argument yet.....
i mentioned dolphins, they are mammals. they were talking fish, bass carp trout ect ect
Iwanci wrote:Vulcanic, that was my point precisely, when it comes to god and or belief there are no facts, but the amazing fact is that people site religious dogma as fact, when, as rightly you point out, there is no fact. So to say that some god said something is indeed based in zero fact and hence is not worthy of mention as a valid argument.
I place little value in what the ‘ancients’ said my friend. What know that the ancients did not have the same level of understanding of the world that we do (depending on the source and subject of course), and much of what they spoke of was based on belief rather than fact, we also know that their belief was ‘paganistic’ in so many ways. I do agree that they got some material correct, like for example their understanding of astronomy etc, but this too depends on which ancients we are referring to. We also know that much of what was believed is open to interpretation, so, whilst we have a general understanding of the ancient beliefs, we also balance that with the fact that they also got a lot of things wrong due to their limited understanding. So again, citing that the ‘god enki’ said anything is not evidence or proof of anything, quite the contrary, it delegitimizes any argument in my opinion.
I share the same belief as you do and believe that all living things ‘feel’ to some extent, I believe that when we think through the process it makes sense because this ‘feeling’ is what provides the creature with its ‘flight’ or ‘fight’ instinct. If fish for example felt no pain and hence had no fear, they would swim up to anyone or thing, what we find is quite different, fish swim away from predators, could be fear, but this too is a feeling.
The fact you site that dogs are beaten because it makes the meat taste better if true is indicative of the fact that the dogs are a food source to these people. Personally, I find it distasteful (pardon the pun) to think of eating a dog but to some cultures there is no distinction between food sources, so a dog has just as much legitimacy as food as a fish or a cow or plant, to those people. Just because we do not agree with it does not make it right nor wrong.
Also, stating that fish serve no purpose (do not help man in any way) is also not correct, they play a vital role in the ecosystem and food chain of which man is a part, at the very least they are a food source and this alone serves a great purpose. This point you raise is subjective too as many people would argue that a dog serves less purpose than a fish. Imagine you dislike dogs for example, what purpose would you see for them other than eating food, barking, and shitting on the pavement, more of a nuisance than man’s best friend. Personally, I love dogs, they are by far one of my favourite animals and I do see a purpose in the friendship and happiness they bring many people and I am appalled by cruelty towards these animals, but my feelings don’t make me right some may disagree with me.
At any rate, good discussion my friend, no offence intended by the way, just in case I came across that way...
thank you, and you too we both are right, i'm looking at in from a usa culture eyes, like you said before who are to judge another country or culture.
boggles me that asians are very smart for the most part but rino horns , tigers, elephants , blue fin tuna ,shark fin soup, dogs, cats, ect ect they seem to want to eat things that are going extint or ones we use as pets with lame unproven claims of what it will do for you if you eat them.
but who am i to judge, but again if i don't judge then my childrens children may never get to see a living tiger in there lifetime and that would be a shame for future generations. its a very tough call.
vulcanic i'm sorry that your cat passed away m8 25 human years that is a really good and lenghty life your cat had,i'm with u on the cruelty thing m8 dog really is mans best friend and i have seen countless programs about hero dogs both me and my mrs would do anything for our dogs and we know our dogs would do the same i cant stand bastards that are cruel to any animal,the way i see it they have got to have a screw loose to to torture and kill animals for nothing,and they should have the same done to them,all animals have got as much right to live a long and happy life on earth as much as man has
For every dark night there's a brighter day
Andyg2011 wrote:vulcanic i'm sorry that your cat passed away m8 25 human years that is a really good and lenghty life your cat had,i'm with u on the cruelty thing m8 dog really is mans best friend and i have seen countless programs about hero dogs both me and my mrs would do anything for our dogs and we know our dogs would do the same i cant stand bastards that are cruel to any animal,the way i see it they have got to have a screw loose to to torture and kill animals for nothing,and they should have the same done to them,all animals have got as much right to live a long and happy life on earth as much as man has
Thank you I almost thought she be in the record books but saw the oldest was 36 years old, I agree with you I'm not sure why some people just don't see it that way , to me it's hard to miss, we are lucky to have animals that like us and dogs have a long history with us they grew and adapted to us ect ect
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