Obama Starts Another Illegal War, Rangel Calls For Draft

Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:31 am » by **Redwoodrick**

muchtyman wrote:
redwoodrick wrote:Trying to tie this multilateral UN action to Iraq is juvenile and ignorant.Calling it an "illegal war" is just plain stupid.If you were familiar with the laws in the US regarding participation in UN actions you would know better than to call this an "illegal war".It is neither illegal nor war.Educate yourself before quoting people who either do not know or do not care to know the facts.
And pray you never find yourself in a country who's citizens are being massacred by a madman.
You either are biased towards anti Americanism,or you have not read the UN resolution or watched ANY independent news sources.You should educate yourself,Harbin,on the facts before regurgitating slanted opinions from opinion pieces.
http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/

Hi Red

As is obvious I ain't an American Citizen and I ain't Anti American ( The People that is ) ..............But................

" Neither Illegal nor war " ?.............what is it when you launch 200 plus tomahawks to destroy another sovereign nations military ..........A sure definition of war as I've seen .

I was under the impression only Congress could declare war

Have things changed ?

Hey Muchty,
.
The difference between this UN action and war is that
1) No occupation.
2) No soldiers on the ground.
3) limit targets to military installations and airports.

The reasons it is not "illegal"
1) Unanimous UN resolution.
2)Action requested by majority of citizens of said country
3) Arab league approval and support.
4) Imminent and observable humanitarian crisis.

I am not saying we are in it for altruistic reasons.There is surely political motivation.But it is not to "steal their oil".Debating the assumption of sinister motives on the part of the US is for another thread and I might not wholly disagree.But it is clearly not a war and certainly not illegal.
And to posit that the US,France,Brittain,Qatar,United Arab Emirates,Canada,Italy and the rest of the world are in joint conspiracy to wage war on Libya for her tiny amount of oil reeks of uninformed contrarian reactionism.

Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:31 am » by **Whiteknight2000**

What is the United Nations? The United Nations is basically a World Government. Which is all countries representatives gather together as a global government.

Why shouldn't that be above America? Are you suggesting that America should be above every other country out there? Because that sounds like it.

The United Nations is a power which keeps everything in check. Which try's to keep things fair. It's just like any other government out there. It's not perfect but it does come in handy in times of crisis.

Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:35 am » by **Whiteknight2000**

muchtyman wrote:
whiteknight2000 wrote:I think you should of done your research MARBIN before you accuse the U.S of Anything.

This is not an illegal war. why?

1. The Arabian council went to the UN and asked for help. They wanted military action to happen in Libya.
2. France stepped in and said they would help.
3. Britain said they would step in.
4. America was the last one to step in. Obama did not want to start another war and make America seem like its the bad guy after power and destruction. It was the last thing he wanted.

America was forced to do this. They were trying to avoid this at all costs, and then they decided to step in because the rebels were losing. They were losing. So they had no choice.

Would you rather see millions of civilians die because of Gudaffi? Because that's what would of happened if no one did anything about this.

As soon as Gudaffi took back Libya he would of killed everyone who wasn't loyal to him.

Of course now people like Marbin have immediately stepped in and Automatically accused America of being the bad guy. And funnily enough a week ago most of you were saying Obama was weak. You were saying he should step in.

Now of course your saying he's starting an illegal war. That itself is being two faced.

I just hope that this will be a quick combat, and will be resolved quickly and I hope that after that peace follows.

So next time do some research before you make judgements about America.

This is not illegal. Do your research!!!!

Last of all that statement by George bush senior saying "NEW WORLD ORDER". How is that proof? What does "NEW WORLD ORDER" mean??? He just say's NEW WORLD ORDER. It can be interpreted as anything.

And a lot of people took advantage of that and created something scary about it. Middle Easterns have been doing the very best they could to make America the bad guy. To make America the one that is after Oil. To make America the one who want a New world order.

Saudi Arabia is the one who is really controlling a whole bunch of places because we are the ones who are relying on them to supply us with oil.

As soon as we stop relying on oil will be the day that we will stop relying on the middle east.

I agree, HARBIN's opinion is biased an is filled with a lot of Anti-American hate. Why do you think there's alot of Anti-American bullshit going around?

Because America is a threat to Autocracies. America is a threat the the middle east, Saudi Arabia. Because they still have Autocracies. Once people start asking for freedom, and democracy. Autocracy will be a thing of the past.

Your petticoat is showing again ...........................

Which means - I have nothing further to say but I'm still pissed off at you so I may as well start to insult you instead.

Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:45 am » by **Muchtyman**

whiteknight2000 wrote:What is the United Nations? The United Nations is basically a World Government. Which is all countries representatives gather together as a global government.

Why shouldn't that be above America? Are you suggesting that America should be above every other country out there? Because that sounds like it.

The United Nations is a power which keeps everything in check. Which try's to keep things fair. It's just like any other government out there. It's not perfect but it does come in handy in times of crisis.

If you think I'm being Insulting , you're wrong .

“ U.S. Constitution. Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution clearly states that the United States Congress has the power to declare war. The President does not. That was the Founders’ intent. "

Just having a friendly debate :cheers:

With regard to the above article ........In law ..The USA is not answerable to the United Nations .

That also includes every other country \ nation state on this earth .

Mon Mar 21, 2011 3:59 am » by **Redwoodrick**

muchtyman wrote:
whiteknight2000 wrote:What is the United Nations? The United Nations is basically a World Government. Which is all countries representatives gather together as a global government.

Why shouldn't that be above America? Are you suggesting that America should be above every other country out there? Because that sounds like it.

The United Nations is a power which keeps everything in check. Which try's to keep things fair. It's just like any other government out there. It's not perfect but it does come in handy in times of crisis.

If you think I'm being Insulting , you're wrong .

“ U.S. Constitution. Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution clearly states that the United States Congress has the power to declare war. The President does not. That was the Founders’ intent. "

Just having a friendly debate

With regard to the above article ........In law ..The USA is not answerable to the United Nations .

That also includes every other country \ nation state on this earth .

With regard to the above article ........In law ..The USA is not answerable to the United Nations .

That also includes every other country \ nation state on this earth

True.But not indicative of illegal action on part of the US in regards to this action in Libya.

The difference between this UN action and war is that
1) No occupation.
2) No soldiers on the ground.
3) limit targets to military installations and airports.

The reasons it is not "illegal"
1) Unanimous UN resolution.
2)Action requested by majority of citizens of said country
3) Arab league approval and support.
4) Imminent and observable humanitarian crisis.

Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:04 am » by **Muchtyman**

redwoodrick wrote:
muchtyman wrote:
whiteknight2000 wrote:What is the United Nations? The United Nations is basically a World Government. Which is all countries representatives gather together as a global government.

Why shouldn't that be above America? Are you suggesting that America should be above every other country out there? Because that sounds like it.

The United Nations is a power which keeps everything in check. Which try's to keep things fair. It's just like any other government out there. It's not perfect but it does come in handy in times of crisis.

If you think I'm being Insulting , you're wrong .

“ U.S. Constitution. Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution clearly states that the United States Congress has the power to declare war. The President does not. That was the Founders’ intent. "

Just having a friendly debate

With regard to the above article ........In law ..The USA is not answerable to the United Nations .

That also includes every other country \ nation state on this earth .

With regard to the above article ........In law ..The USA is not answerable to the United Nations .

That also includes every other country \ nation state on this earth

True.But not indicative of illegal action on part of the US in regards to this action in Libya.

The difference between this UN action and war is that
1) No occupation.
2) No soldiers on the ground.
3) limit targets to military installations and airports.

The reasons it is not "illegal"
1) Unanimous UN resolution.
2)Action requested by majority of citizens of said country
3) Arab league approval and support.
4) Imminent and observable humanitarian crisis.

Fair enough Red ...........Remember that if and when the UN authorises foreign troops to keep the peace in the States sometime . G'Nite ............ :cheers:

Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:10 am » by **Redwoodrick**

Fair enough Red ...........Remember that if and when the UN authorises foreign troops to keep the peace in the States sometime . G'Nite ............

If the US is ever involved in a civil demonstration and the resident president starts cutting us down in droves with bullets and bombs and promises to kill "every last one of the rats and cockroaches" opposed to the president,then I will welcome the help of the UN to take out the war machine and give us a fighting chance.
Won't happen and wouldn't work if it did,but you get the idea.
Thanks for the discourse :flop:

Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:46 am » by **Redwoodrick**

oh,how they must regret it now,but personally i think the arab league is fake arab league,there mission is to see the downfall of mid-east nations,they are a plant.

Dude you are squawking out yer arse.You strike me as possessed of neither the intelligence nor political education to make such base accusations.
If you know what the fuck you are talking about,please explain.
If not......well..you know..the whole "piehole" thing :cheers:

Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:17 am » by **Iamcare**

I gotta say I agree with Red on this one. I'm equally liking and cursing whats going on in Lybia because the will of the people is that foreign states intervene, Ghadaffi has been armed, trained then hung out to dry in the same way Saddam Hussein was.

The problem with this is its giving tptb a chance to redeem themselves in the eyes of the people, the next time they do launch an illegal war, be it against Korea, Iran or China, they will have the good grace of the people behind them, beleiving they have changed for the better and only use the military for humanitarian purposes.

I am against intervening in revolutionary proceedures in any country without the obvious and express will of the majority of the country. Everyone on this planet has to learn to stand the fuck up for themselves and realise that if they ask other to conduct a revolution for them, then they are only inviting a different tyranny. The only worthwhile revolution for the masses is one conducted by the oppressed masses, as was shown in egypt, and if the people of Lybia truly want revolution then they vastly outnumber the armed forces, so it will happen of their own accord.

Mon Mar 21, 2011 5:24 am » by **Redwoodrick**

am against intervening in revolutionary procedures in any country without the obvious and express will of the majority of the country. Everyone on this planet has to learn to stand the fuck up for themselves and realise that if they ask other to conduct a revolution for them, then they are only inviting a different tyranny. The only worthwhile revolution for the masses is one conducted by the oppressed masses, as was shown in Egypt, and if the people of Lybia truly want revolution then they vastly outnumber the armed forces, so it will happen of their own accord.

well said