Right wing has history of rewriting history

Initiate
User avatar
Posts: 933
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:39 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 5:45 pm » by Middleman


If you insist, I'll play. Michelle Bachmann ,Marco Rubio, Allen West, Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Lamar Smith, Steve King, Jim DeMint, Mike Lee and Pat Toomey.

The media pays attention when they speak. They are regulars on cable TV news and the Sunday morning shows.

Apart from Glen Beck aficionados, who the hell has even heard of Danny Davis?

When has the congressional black caucus ever had any major influence? I’m not sure I’ve even heard of the “Democratic Socialists of America”, and I’m a socialist.

Paul Ryan isn't even a Tea Party guy (many of them reject him as too moderate), but his proposed budget aims to keep military spending the same, while cutting the shit out of programs for the most vulnerable people, according to the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops.

Conspirator
Posts: 1453
Joined: Sun May 01, 2011 6:05 am

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 5:58 pm » by Perronick


Rydher wrote:
Perronick wrote:
Rydher wrote:How so? If you're speaking of the American Right/Left. On the extreme left you have total government and on the extreme right you have no government.

To pretend that there isn't a huge difference between the two ideologies is ignorant, IMO.


On what you call the extreme left, Anarchism, there's no Gov. either. There are differences, indeed, in Anarchism there is private property, but this is collective instead of individual property.


Please reread what I said. The extreme left, meaning all the way at the left end of the spectrum is TOTAL GOVERNMENT. The extreme right, meaning all the way at the right end of the spectrum is NO GOVERNMENT


Anarchism is left wing, I'm sorry, that's just the way it is, and it advocates no Government. I think you're mistaking Reps vs Dems, it might seem similar but it's not. Also, that Spectrum you talk about is highly theoretical, none of the extremes exist in reality. Therefore I have to insist that the debate is sterile for us, the People.

Rydher wrote:It's nothing like arguing over which is better Judo or Karate. It's arguing over the level of control the state has over the individual. And that argument is worth having and defending.


That's a more substantial debate, then why talking about left vs right?

There's an old fable about two hares debating if the dogs chasing them were pointers or greyhounds. Guess how it ends, yes, both hares end up dead and stewed.

Conspirator
User avatar
Posts: 4007
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:03 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 6:07 pm » by Rydher


You're problem, other than being completely dishonest when talking about this. Is you are stuck on Republican Vs. Democrat. To put Ron Paul into the same category as more than half that list shows your inability to comprehend the discussion. So, if no one has heard of someone or a group on the media. It doesn't exist? I'm sure you've heard of the Communist Party USA though. Either way...

You're a socialist, so you are to the American left. But unless you consider yourself a communist or a fascist, you aren't at the extreme left. They are two different sides of the same coin, both at the extreme end of the spectrum. Both part of the the American left, albeit the extreme.

That's the difference between the American Left/Right and the European Left/Right, and my point all along. That, for some reason you have been desperately trying to avoid and make this about Republican/Democrat.


@Perronick - You're analogy is another bad one that doesn't work with the discussion. If you admit that a good debate to have is the level of control the state has over an individual is a better debate. Then you're whole confusion over American Right/Left is a misunderstanding on your part.

Total government control over the individual = At the very extreme of the left
No government control over the individual = At the very extreme of the right

Conspirator
User avatar
Posts: 4007
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:03 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 6:24 pm » by Rydher


Perronick wrote:Anarchism is left wing, I'm sorry, that's just the way it is, and it advocates no Government.


I'm finding this conversation fascinating. Help me out here, so I can understand your way of thinking. If being an anarchist, advocating no government is left wing. Then what is Communism? Left or Right?

Initiate
User avatar
Posts: 933
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:39 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 6:39 pm » by Middleman


Rydher wrote:To put Ron Paul into the same category as more than half that list shows your inability to comprehend the discussion.


Ron and Rand Paul put themselves in that category, by formally becoming members of the Tea Party Caucus, just like all the other individuals I named except for Rubio, who is still a Tea Party man through and through, but refused to join because he doesn't believe in clubs.

I'm not defending Democrats or the system here, for what that's worth. I recognize the 2 party shell game for what it is, and also acknowledge that despite identifying as a socialist, my views on things like freedom of speech, freedom of the internet, drugs, and foreign policy are MUCH closer to Ron Paul's than Barrack Obama's.

Conspirator
User avatar
Posts: 5967
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:24 pm
Location: Evildweeb 2.5

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 6:43 pm » by Evildweeb


It's a very fine line between changing book content (or better yet adding more information) and rewrites.

Referring to slavery as what? In all my years I have never heard it referred to in that manner. Obviously that is a rewrite.

Also despite the "opinion" of christian fundamentalism, the constitution of the US clearly states a separation of church and state, and did not specifically indoctrinate christianity, but clearly laid out the basis for freedom of all religion.

If anyone is concerned about the rewriting of history, especially where Texas is concerned, you may be interested in the "historical account" of the Alamo. I put that in quotes for a very good reason.

Nice post btw.

cheers

:cheers:
Image

Beer acquisition continues up to the point of some form of saturation and is driven on a course directed by the path of least resistance to the fridge

Conspirator
Posts: 1453
Joined: Sun May 01, 2011 6:05 am

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 6:49 pm » by Perronick


The American Reps/Dems and the European Left/Right ended up being the exact same, they only argue about what type of big Government are they going to push for, despite all the ideological costume party. Now that we're all stewing in our own juice, tell me, was the debate at least interesting?

Left and Right are just means to achieve something else. Who cares if total domination is called Fascism or Communism? or if facism is Right or Left? We're missing the point.


Upload to Disclose.tv


Conspirator
User avatar
Posts: 4007
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:03 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 7:03 pm » by Rydher


Perronick wrote:The American Reps/Dems and the European Left/Right ended up being the exact same, they only argue about what type of big Government are they going to push for

I agree with you 100%. I was illustrating the difference of what the difference was between the American and European Left/Right (which is, like you said, what type of big government you want). I was never talking about, nor did I mention, Republican Vs. Democrat.

On this board, with people posting from all over the world. People throw around the terms left and right wing when they don't mean the same thing. I was simply pointing that out and was challenged on it.

I'm still confused on how you can put people that advocate no government as being left wing. Using the American political system, no government is as far to the right as you can get. Using the European system, I suppose they would be right in the middle or I contend. They don't exist since the base line measurement is the government already controlling everything. Any other way of governing doesn't exist.

Conspirator
User avatar
Posts: 4007
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:03 pm

PostWed Apr 25, 2012 7:07 pm » by Rydher


Middleman wrote: and also acknowledge that despite identifying as a socialist, my views on things like freedom of speech, freedom of the internet, drugs, and foreign policy are MUCH closer to Ron Paul's than Barrack Obama's.

It sounds like you want the freedom to do what ever you want. While society provides you with everything you need, so that you don't have to do anything to earn it.

Conspirator
Posts: 2312
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:34 pm

PostThu Apr 26, 2012 12:40 am » by Cia212


Evildweeb wrote:It's a very fine line between changing book content (or better yet adding more information) and rewrites.

Referring to slavery as what? In all my years I have never heard it referred to in that manner. Obviously that is a rewrite.

Thanks for getting the discussion back on topic. You never heard of the triangular trade? Then this is a good example of, not a rewrite, but merely providing more information.

The triangular trade refers to either the 3 ports - British, African and American - or the 3 products - molasses, rum and slaves - that comprised a large part of and affected the entire economy at the time. To call it simply "slave trade" ignores how deeply entrenched the practice was and cheapens the suffering that occurred. It's not a rewrite, because nothing that was written is being rewritten, it's only including more information. Everyone should hear about this in grade school.

BTW – even this is an extremely simplified model that doesn’t begin to do justice to the intricacies of the trade.


PreviousNext

  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post
Visit Disclose.tv on Facebook