The Atlantis Mystery

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PostTue Feb 05, 2013 1:37 am » by Kinninigan



The Atlantis Mystery

Excerpted from Mysteries of The Lost Lands

by Eleanor Van Zandt and Roy Stemman
circa - 1976

The riddle of Atlantis is among the greatest of the world's unsolved mysteries.

Where, for a start, was the exact site of this huge island civilization? Did it really, as early historians reported, vanish from the earth in a day and a night? Small wonder that since the earliest times scholars, archaeologists, historians, and occultists have kept up an almost ceaseless search for its precise whereabouts.

Beginning with the Greek philosopher Plato's first description of the lost land that was apparently "the nearest thing to paradise on Earth," this chapter examines in detail the basic evidence for the existence and cataclysmic destruction of Atlantis.

(Note: Plato was not the first one to know about Atlantis. He was the first to describe it in detail. Pythagoras taught Plato what he knew)

Of all the world's unsolved mysteries, Atlantis is probably the biggest.

Said to have been a huge island continent with an extraordinary civilization, situated in the Atlantic Ocean, it is reported to have vanished from the face of the earth in a day and a night. So complete was this devastation that Atlantis sank beneath the sea, taking with it every trace of its existence.

Despite this colossal vanishing trick, the lost continent of Atlantis has exerted a mysterious influence over the human race for thousands of years. It is almost as though a primitive memory of the glorious days of Atlantis lingers on in the deepest recesses of the human mind.

The passage of time has not diminished interest in the fabled continent, nor have centuries of skepticism by scientists succeeded in banishing Atlantis to obscurity in its watery grave. Thousands of books and articles have been written about the lost continent. It has inspired the authors of novels, short stories, poems, and movies.

Its name has been used for ships, restaurants, magazines, and even a region of the planet Mars.

Atlantean societies have been formed to theorize and speculate about a great lost land. Atlantis has come to symbolize our dream of a once golden past. It appeals to our nostalgic longing for a better, happier world; it feeds out hunger for knowledge of mankind's true origins; and above all it offers the challenge of a genuinely sensational detective story.

Today the search for evidence of the existence of Atlantis continues with renewed vigor, using 20th century man's most sophisticated tools in the hope of discovering the continent that is said to have disappeared around 11,600 years ago.

Did Atlantis exist, or is it just a myth? Ours may be the generation that finally solves this tantalizing and ancient enigma.

Atlantis is said to have been the nearest thing to paradise that the earth has seen. Fruits and vegetables grew in abundance in its rich soil. Fragrant flowers and herbs bloomed n the wooded slopes of its many beautiful mountains. All kinds of tame and wild animals roamed its meadows and magnificent forests, and drank from its rivers and lakes. Underground streams of wonderfully sweet water were used to irrigate the soil, to provide hot and cold fountains and baths for all the inhabitants. There were even baths for the horses.

The earth was rich in precious metals, and the Atlanteans were wealthier than any people before or after with gold, silver, brass, tin, and ivory, and their principal royal palace was a marvel of size and beauty.

Besides being skilled metallurgists, the Atlanteans were accomplished engineers. A huge and complex system of canals and bridges linked their capital city with the sea and the surrounding countryside, and there were magnificent docks and harbors for the fleets of vessels that carried on a flourishing trade with overseas countries.

Whether they lived in the city or the country, the people of Atlantis had everything they could possibly want for their comfort and happiness. They were a gentle, wise, and loving people, unaffected by their great wealth and prizing virtue above all things.

In time, however, their noble nature became debased. No longer satisfied with ruling their own great land of plenty, they set about waging war on others. Their vast armies swept through the Strait of Gibraltar into the Mediterranean region, conquering large areas of North Africa and Europe.

The Atlanteans were poised to strike against Athens and Egypt when the Athenian army rose up, drove them back to Gibraltar, and defeated them.

Hardly had the Athenians tasted victory when a terrible cataclysm wiped out their entire army in a single day and night, and caused Atlantis to sink forever beneath the waves. Perhaps a few survivors were left to tell what happened. At all events, the story is said to have been passed down through many generations until, more than 9200 years later, it was made known to the world for the first time.

The man who first committed the legend to paper was the Greek philosopher Plato, who in about 355 B.C. wrote about Atlantis in two of his famous dialogues, the Timaeus and the Critias.

Although Plato claimed that the story of the lost continent was derived from ancient Egyptian records, no such records have ever come to light, nor has any direct mention of Atlantis been found in any surviving records made before Plato's time. Every book and article on Atlantis that has ever been published has been based on Plato's account; subsequent authors have merely interpreted or added to it.

Plato was a master storyteller who put his philosophical ideas across in the form of apparently real-life events with well-known characters, and his Atlantis story might well have been firmly relegated to the realms of fiction. The very fact that it is still widely relegated as a factual account 2300 years after he wrote it shows the extraordinary power of Plato's story.

It has inspired scholars to stake their reputation on the former existence of the lost continent, and explorers to go in search of its remains.

Their actions were prompted not by the Greek story alone, bit also by their own discoveries, which seemed to indicate that there must once have been a great landmass that acted as a bridge between our existing continents.

Map of Atlantis by the 17th-century German scholar Athanasius Kircher. Kircher based his
map on Plato's description of Atlantis as an island west of the Pillars of Hercules - the
Strait of Gibraltar - and situated Atlantis in the ocean that has since been named after the
legendary land. Unlike modern cartographers, he placed south at the top of the map, which
puts America at the right.

Why, ask the scholars, are there so many remarkable similarities between the ancient cultures of the Old and New Worlds?

Why do we find the same plants and animals on continents thousands of miles apart when there is no known way for them to have been transported there?

How did the primitive peoples of many lands construct technological marvels, such as Stonehenge in Britain, the huge statues of Easter Island in the Pacific and the strange sacred cities of the Andes?

Were they helped by a technically sophisticated race that has since disappeared?

Above all, why do the legends of people the world over tell the same story of an overwhelming natural disaster and the arrival or godlike beings who brought with them a new culture from a far?

Could the catastrophe that sank Atlantis have sent tidal waves throughout the glove, causing terrible havoc and destruction?

And were the 'gods' the remnants of the Atlantean race - the few survivors who were not on or near the island continent when it was engulfed?

Even without Plato's account, the quest for answers to these mysteries might have led to the belief by some in a 'missing link' between the continents - a land-bridge populated by a highly evolved people in the distant past.

Nevertheless, it is the Greek philosopher's story that lies at the heart of all arguments for or against the existence of such a lost continent.

Plato intended writing a trilogy in which the Atlantis story plays an important part, but he completed only one of the works, Timaeus, and part of the second, Critias.

Like Plato's other writings, they take the form of dialogues or playlets in which a group of individuals discuss various political and moral issues. Leading the discussion is Plato's old teacher, the Greek philosopher Socrates.

His debating companions are Timaeus, an astronomer from Italy, Critias, a poet and historian who was a distant relative of Plato, and Hermocrates, a general from Syracuse. Plato had already used the same cat of real-life characters in his most famous dialogue, The Republic, written some years previously, and he planned his trilogy as a sequel to that debate, in which the four men had talked at some length about ideal government.

Plato set the meeting of the four men in Critia's house in June 421 B.C. Timaeus begins on the day following the debate recorded in The Republic, and the men start by recalling their previous conversation.

Then Hermocrates mentions,

"a story derived from ancient tradition" that Critias knows.

Pressed for details, Critias recalls how, a century and a half earlier, the great Athenian statesman Solon had visited Egypt (Solon was a real person and he did visit Egypt, although his trip took place around 590 B.C., so 20 years earlier than the date given by Plato.)

Critias says that while Solon was in Sais, an Egyptian city having close ties with Athens, a group of priests told him the story of Atlantis,

"a tale that, though strange, is certainly true."

Solon made notes of the conversation, and intended recording the story for posterity, but he did not do so.

Instead he told it to a relative, Dropides, who passed it on to his son, Critias the elder, who eventually told his grandson, another Critias - the man who features in Plato's dialogues.

In Timaeus Critias gives a brief account of what the priests had told Solon. According to ancient Egyptian records there had been a great Athenian empire 9000 years earlier (that is, in about 9600 B.C.) At the same time there had been a mighty empire of Atlantis based on an island or continent west of the Pillars of Hercules (the Strait of Gibraltar) that was larger than North Africa and Asia Minor combined.

Beyond it lay a chain of islands that stretched across the ocean to another huge continent.


The Atlanteans ruled over their central island and several others, and over parts of the great continent on the other side of the ocean.

Then their armies struck eastward into the Mediterranean region, conquering North Africa as far as Egypt and southern Europe up to the Greek borders.

"This vast power, gathered into one, endeavored to subdue at one blow our country and yours," said the Egyptian priests, "and the whole of the region within the strait..."

Athens, standing alone, defeated the Atlanteans.

"But afterward there occurred violent earthquakes and floods; and in a single day and night of destruction all your warlike men in a body sank into the earth, and the island of Atlantis in a like manner disappeared in the depths of the sea. For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is so much shallow mud in the way, caused by the subsidence of the island."

Socrates is delighted with Critias' story, which as,

"the very great advantage of being a fact and not a fiction."

However, the rest of Timaeus is taken up with a discourse on science, and the the story of Atlantis is continued in Plato's next dialogue, the Critias, where Critias gives a much fuller description of the island continent. He goes back to the island's very beginning when the gods were apportioned parts of the earth, as is usual in ancient histories.

Poseidon, Greek god of the sea and also of earthquakes, was given Atlantis, and there he fell in love with a mortal maiden called Cleito.

Cleito dwelled on a hill in Atlantis, and to prevent anyone reaching her home, Poseidon encircled the hill with alternate rings of land and water,

"two of land and three of water, which he turned as with a lathe."

He also laid on abundant supplies of food and water to the hill,

"bringing up two springs of water from beneath the earth, one of warm water and the other of cold, and making every variety of food to spring up abundantly from the soil."

Poseidon and Cleito produced 10 children - five pairs of male twins - and Poseidon divided Atlantis and its adjacent islands among these 10 sons to rule as a confederacy of kings.

The first born of the eldest twins, Atlas (after whom atlantis was named), was made chief king. The kinds in turn had numerous children, and their descendants ruled for many generations.

Ass the population of Atlantis grew and developed, the people accomplished great feats of engineering and architecture. They accomplished great feats of engineering and architecture. The built palaces and temples, harbors and docks, and reaped the rich harvest of their agricultural and mineral resources.

The kings and their descendants built the city of Atlantis around Cleito's hill on the southern coast of the island continent. It was a circular city, about 11 miles in diameter, and Cleito's hill, surrounded by its concentric rings of land and water, formed a citadel about three miles in diameter, situated at the very center of the impressive city.

The kings built bridges to connect the land rings, and tunnels through which ships could pass from one ring of water to the next. The rings of land were surrounded by stone walls plated with precious metals, and another wall ran around the entire city. The outermost ring of water became a great harbor, crowded with shipping.

A huge canal, 300 feet wide and 100 feet deep, linked the great harbor with the sea at the southern end, and joined the city to a vast irrigated plain, sheltered by lofty mountains, which lay beyond the city walls in the north. This rectangular plain, measuring 230 by 340 miles, was divided into 60,000 square lots, assigned to farmers.

The mountains beyond housed,

"many wealthy villages of country folk, and rivers, and lakes, and meadows, supplying food for every animal, wild or tame, and much wood of various sorts, abundant for each and every kind of work."

The inhabitants of the mountains and of the rest of the country were,

"a vast multitude having leaders to whom they were assigned according to their dwellings and villages."

These leaders and the farmers on the plane were each required to supply men for the Atlantean army, which included light and heavy infantry, cavalry, and chariots.

Plato and Critias paint a vivid picture of Atlantean engineering and architecture with an attention to detail that bears the hallmark of a very factual account.

Critias tells how the stone used for the city's buildings was quarried from beneath the island (Cleito's hill) and from beneath the outer and inner circles of land.

"One kind of stone was white, another black, and third red, and as they quarried they at the same time hollowed out docks within, having roofs formed of the native rock. Some of their buildings were simple, but in others they put together different stones, which they intermingled for the sake of ornament, to be a natural source of delight."

But it was into their magnificent temples that the Atlanteans poured their greatest artistic and technical skills.

In the center of the citadel was a holy artistic and technical skills. In the center of the citadel was a holy temple dedicated to Cleito and Poseidon and this was surrounded by an enclosure of gold. Nearby stood Poseidon's own temple, a superb structure covered in silver, with pinnacles of gold.

The roof's interior was covered with ivory, and lavishly decorated with gold, silver, and orichalcum - probably a fine grade of brass or bronze - which,

"glowed like fire."

Inside the temple was a massive gold statue of Poseidon driving a chariot drawn by six winged horses and surrounded by 100 sea nymphs on dolphins. This was so high that its head touched the temple roof.

Gold statues of Atlantis' original 10 kings and their wives stood outside the temple. Critias tells of the beautiful buildings that were constructed around the warm and cold fountains in the center of the city.

Trees were planted between the buildings, and cisterns were designed - some open to the heavens, others roofed over - to be used as baths.

"There were the kinds' baths, and the baths of private persons, which were kept apart; and there were separate baths for women, and for horses and cattle , and to each of them they gave as much adornment as was suitable.

Of the water that ran off they carried some to the grove of Poseidon, where were growing all manner of trees of wonderful height and beauty, owing to the excellence of the soil, while the remainder was conveyed by aqueducts along the bridges to the the outer circles; and there were many temples built and dedicated to many gods; also gardens and places of exercise, some for men, and others for horses in both of the two islands formed by the zones (rings of water) ; and in the center of the larger of the two there was set apart a racecourse of a stadium (about 607 feet) in width, and in length allowed to extend all around the island, for horses to race in."

At alternate intervals of five and six years the 10 kings of Atlantis met in the temple of Poseidon to consult on matters of government and to administer justice. During this meeting a strange ritual was enacted.

After offering up prayers to the gods, the kings were required to hunt bulls, which roamed freely within the temple, and to capture one of them for sacrifice, using only staves and nooses.

The captured animal was led to a bronze column in the temple, on which the laws of Atlantis were inscribed, and was slain so that its blood ran over the sacred inscription. After further ceremony, the kings partook of a banquet and when darkness fell they wrapped themselves in beautiful dark-blue robes, sitting in a circle they gave their judgments, which were recorded at daybreak on tablets of gold.

In the course of time, the people of Atlantis began to lose the love of wisdom and virtue that they had inherited from Poseidon. As their divine nature was diluted and human nature got the upper hand, they became greedy, corrupt, and domineering.

Whereupon, says Plato,

"Zeus, the god of gods, who rules by law, and is able to see into such things, perceiving that an honorable race was in a most wretched state, and wanting to punish them that they might be chastened and improve, collected all the gods into his most holy abode, which, being placed into his most holy abode, which, being placed in the center of the universe, sees all things that partake of generation. And when he had called them together he spoke as follows..."

And there, enigmatically, and frustratingly, Plato's story of Atlantis breaks off, never to be completed.

Some regard the Critias dialogue as a rough draft that Plato abandoned. Others assume he intended to continue the story in the third part of his trilogy, but he never even started that work. He went on, instead, to write his last dialogue, The Laws.

Controversy has raged over Plato's story ever since he wrote it 2300 years ago. Was his account fact, part-fact, or total fiction?

Each explanation has its inherents, and each has been hotly defended over the centuries. Plato's story certainly presents a number of problems. Critics of the Atlantis theory claim that these invalidate the story as a factual account. Supporters maintain that they can be accepted as poetic license, exaggeration, or understandable mistakes that have crept in during the telling and retelling of the story over many centuries before Plato reported it.

The greatest stumbling block is the date that the Greek philosopher gives for the destruction of Atlantis. The Egyptian priests are said to have told Solon that Atlantis was destroyed 9000 years before his visit, in about 9600 B.C., which is far earlier than any known evidence of civilization.

Supporters of Atlantis point out that modern discoveries are constantly pushing back the boundaries of human prehistory and we may yet discover that civilization is far older than we think. However, Plato makes it clear that in 9600 B.C., Athens was also the home of a mighty civilization that defeated the Atlanteans.

Archaeologists claim that their knowledge of Greece in the early days of its development is sufficiently complete to rule out the possibility of highly developed people in that country as early as 9600 B.C.

Their evidence suggests that either Plato's story is an invention or he has the date wrong.

Assuming that Plato's facts are right but his date wrong, what evidence do we have to support his account of the origin of the Atlantis story? Bearing in mind that the war was principally between Atlantis and Athens, it seems odd that there were no Greek records of the battle, and that the account would have originated in Egypt. However Plato has an explanation for this.

The Egyptian priests are said to have told Solon that a series of catastrophes had destroyed the Greek records, whereas their own had been preserved. The problem here is that if the Egyptian disappeared as completely as Atlantis itself.

Supposing that Solon did hear about Atlantis during his Egyptian trip, is it credible that such a detailed story could have been passed down through the generations as Plato asks us to believe? This is not impossible, because the art of accurate oral transmission was highly developed in the ancient world. Moreover, Solon is said to have taken notes of his conversation with the priests, and Critias claims that these were handed down to his relatives.

However, here again we encounter a difficulty. For whereas in one place Critias states that he is still in possession of Solon's notes, in another he declares that he lay awake all night ransacking his memory for details of the Atlantis story that his grandfather had told him. Why didn't he simply refresh his memory from Solon's notes? And why didn't he show the notes to his three companions as incontrovertible proof of the truth of his rather unlikely story?

Yet another problem is that Plato dates the meeting of Socrates, Timaeus, Critias, and Hermocrates, during which Atlantis is discussed, as 421 B.C.

Plato may have been present during their conversation, but as he was only six years old at the time, he could hardly have taken in much of their discussion, let alone made detailed notes of it. Either his account is based on records made my someone else, or the date is wrong, or this part of his story at least is an invention.

Critics of the Atlantis story believe that it is simply a myth invented to put across the great philosopher's views on war and corruption. Plato used real people in his other dialogues, and put his words into their mouths, too, as a dramatic device to present his ideas. There is no reason say the detractors, to assume that Timaeus and Critias are different in this respect, but Plato seems to expect his readers to draw different conclusions.

He is at great pains to stress the truth of his account, tracing it back to Solon, a highly respected statesman with a reputation for being 'straight-tongues,' and having Critias declare that the Atlantis story, "though strange, is certainly true."

And why, if his sole intention was to deliver a philosophical treatise, did Plato fill his account with remarkable detail and then stop abruptly at the very point where we would expect the "message" to be delivered?

In spite of the errors and contradictions that have found their way into Plato's account, his story of Atlantis can still be viewed as an exciting recollection of previously unrecorded events.

History provides us with many examples of supposedly mythical places and subsequently being discovered. For example, Homer wrote about the Trojan War and subsequent research has shown that it was based on real historical events. Troy has since been found and dug up. In 1871, the German archaeologist Heinrich Schlieman excavated in Hissarlik and uncovered Troy just where Homer had placed it over 1000 years previously in his epic poems the Iliad and the Odyssey.

As the Irish scholar J.V. Luce observes in his book The End of Atlantis:

"classical scholars laughed at Schlieman when he set out with Homer in one hand and a spade in the other, but he dug up Troy and thereby demonstrated the inestimable value of folk memory Sir Arthur Evans did much the same thing when he found the labyrinthine home of the Minotaur at Knossos."

Indeed, Sir Arthur Evans revealed that a highly advanced European civilization had flourished on the island of Crete long before the time of Homer, some 4500 years ago.

This should be justification enough to keep an open mind on Plato's account. The problem is that whereas Troy and Knossos were simply buried. Atlantis could be submerged hundred or even thousands of feet beneath the waves. And the force of the destruction may have destroyed the remains beyond recognition.

However, if Plato's account is based on fact, then we know that the Atlanteans traded with their neighbors. In this case there would be some evidence of their influence and culture in lands that survived the catastrophe. Believers in Atlantis have furnished us with a formidable array of such "proofs".

Certainly there are scattered around the glove to lend support to the idea of a highly advanced, Atlantean-type civilization that was responsible.

Although Plato appears to place Atlantis in the Atlantic Ocean and early cartographers did likewise, numerous scholars and other Atlantis enthusiasts have since scoured the globe for more likely sites. Surprisingly, these have not always been in the ocean.

The lost kingdom of Atlantis has been "found" at various times in,

the Pacific Ocean
the North Sea
the Sahara desert
southern Spain
the West Indies

...but to name a few.


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PostSat Jun 15, 2013 11:17 pm » by Kinninigan


I had some great replies in this thread also but I am just happy the OP is still here, I wrote this one day before data was lost!

I will find some more things to add to the thread, here is a pretty new doc that came out I watched, more about the classic atlantis theories and some artifacts they found..


Atlantis - Lost World (Documentary)

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Published on Apr 26, 2013

Documentary on the ancient myth and legend of the lost world/city of Atlantis. Is there any historical fact of the existence of Atlantis?

Atlantis is a legendary island first mentioned in Plato's dialogues Timaeus and Critias, written about 360 BC. According to Plato, Atlantis was a naval power lying "in front of the Pillars of Hercules" that conquered many parts of Western Europe and Africa 9,000 years before the time of Solon, or approximately 9600 BC. After a failed attempt to invade Athens, Atlantis sank into the ocean "in a single day and night of misfortune".
Scholars dispute whether and how much Plato's story or account was inspired by older traditions. In Critias, Plato claims that his accounts of ancient Athens and Atlantis stem from a visit to Egypt by the legendary Athenian lawgiver Solon in the 6th century BC. In Egypt, Solon met a priest of Sais, who translated the history of ancient Athens and Atlantis, recorded on papyri in Egyptian hieroglyphs, into Greek. Some scholars argue Plato drew upon memories of past events such as the Thera eruption or the Trojan War, while others insist that he took inspiration from contemporary events like the destruction of Helike in 373 BC or the failed Athenian invasion of Sicily in 415--413 BC.
The possible existence of a genuine Atlantis was discussed throughout classical antiquity, but it was usually rejected and occasionally parodied by later authors. Alan Cameron states: "It is only in modern times that people have taken the Atlantis story seriously; no one did so in antiquity". The Timaeus remained known in a Latin rendition by Calcidius through the Middle Ages, and the allegorical aspect of Atlantis was taken up by Humanists in utopian works of several Renaissance writers, such as Francis Bacon's New Atlantis and Thomas More's Utopia. Atlantis inspires today's literature, from science fiction to comic books to films. Its name has become a byword for any and all supposed advanced prehistoric lost civilizations.


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PostSun Jun 16, 2013 4:48 am » by The57ironman

Kinninigan wrote:

Upload to



...what did you make of the images at 26:30/27:30..?...looked like a model to me

and who 'foot the bill' for the massive construction covering that excavation..?

if you don't like my opinions....please lower your standards Image


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PostSun Jun 16, 2013 1:01 pm » by Kinninigan

The57ironman wrote:

...what did you make of the images at 26:30/27:30..?...looked like a model to me

and who 'foot the bill' for the massive construction covering that excavation..?


it did look like a model at the part you said

i have no idea who paid for this excavation, i am thinking maybe investors who want some of the artifacts found...

seems its always about money...atlantis artifacts would be "priceless"


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PostSun Jun 16, 2013 1:38 pm » by Rizze

What a great read thanks for bringing it here.

"The greatest things on earth are us,supposedly.
Why don't we act accordingly, with humanity" Rizze

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PostSun Jun 16, 2013 5:29 pm » by flsts1

The57ironman wrote:

...what did you make of the images at 26:30/27:30..?...looked like a model to me

and who 'foot the bill' for the massive construction covering that excavation..?


From what I know of my travels through the Med and a bit of study, was that there were contractors then that were paid through the taxation system by Da Man.
Those images in the time frame are models based on the ruins and artifacts.
More interesting to me is the fact that another Akrotiri was built in Cyprus. (the street planning is similar to what they depicted in this vid...appears to be haphazard but planned out nonetheless) :think:
What even blows me away even more is when travelling through a lot of the the plumbing systems that the old dudes built can still be found all through modern structures in the area...(Italy, Bosnia, Montenegro, Kosovo, Croatia etc...). The homes built all through the Adriatic still use cistern systems and they still employ the same methodology for venting of the a/c required there!

If Edgar were still around he could attest to this....where is that guy anyway? (hope he is alright and comes back....)
Welcome back!

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PostSun Jun 16, 2013 5:44 pm » by The57ironman

flsts1 wrote:
The57ironman wrote:

...what did you make of the images at 26:30/27:30..?...looked like a model to me

and who 'foot the bill' for the massive construction covering that excavation..?


From what I know of my travels through the Med and a bit of study, was that there were contractors then that were paid through the taxation system by Da Man.
Those images in the time frame are models based on the ruins and artifacts.
More interesting to me is the fact that another Akrotiri was built in Cyprus. (the street planning is similar to what they depicted in this vid...appears to be haphazard but planned out nonetheless) :think:
What even blows me away even more is when travelling through a lot of the the plumbing systems that the old dudes built can still be found all through modern structures in the area...(Italy, Bosnia, Montenegro, Kosovo, Croatia etc...). The homes built all through the Adriatic still use cistern systems and they still employ the same methodology for venting of the a/c required there!

If Edgar were still around he could attest to this....where is that guy anyway? (hope he is alright and comes back....)


ah, yes.... :cheers:

and cheers to Edgar.. :cheers:
if you don't like my opinions....please lower your standards Image


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PostSat Sep 21, 2013 5:11 pm » by Kinninigan




Atlantis: the Myth
by Alan G. Hefner

The story of the Isle of Atlantis first occurs in Plato's two dialogues the "Timaeus" and the "Critias." Plato's story centers on Solon, a great Greek legislator and poet who journeyed to Egypt some 150 years earlier. While in the Egyptian city of Sais Solon received the story of Atlantis from priests. The priests respected Solon's reputation and cordially welcomed him. They also respected the Athenians, whom they regarded as kinsmen, because they believed their deity Neith to be the same deity as the Greeks called Athena. Therefore, she was believed to be the patroness and protector of both Greece and Egypt.

The story that the priests told Solon was unknown to him. According to ancient Egyptian temple records the Athenians fought an aggressive war against the rulers of Atlantis some nine thousand years earlier and won.

These ancient and powerful kings or rulers of Atlantis had formed a confederation by which they controlled Atlantis and other islands as well. They began a war from their homeland in the Atlantic Ocean and sent fighting troops to Europe and Asia. Against this attack the men of Athens formed a coalition from all over Greece to halt it. When this coalition met difficulties their allies deserted them and the Athenians fought on alone to defeat the Atlantian rulers. They stopped an invasion of their own country as well as freeing Egypt and eventually every country under the control of the rulers of Atlantis.

Shortly after their victory, even before the Athenians could return home, Atlantis suffered catastrophic earthquakes and floods until it disappeared beneath the sea. All of the brave men were swallowed up in one day and night of horror according to legend. This is why the Egyptians were ever grateful to the Athenians.

Also in the story Plato gives is a history of Atlantis that shows how the rulers eroded to such a state were they wanted to conquer everyone. This history had been recorded by Solon in notes that were handed down through his family.

According to Solon's notes the history of Atlantis began at the beginning of time. It was then that the immortal gods divided the world among themselves and each ruled their proportion. The god Poseidon received Atlantis, an island larger the Libya and Asia combined. He chose for a wife the mortal woman Cleito, and with her begun the royal family of Atlantis.

Poseidon built Cleito's home on a high hill at the very center of the island. The home overlooked a fertile plain bordered by the sea. For his beloved wife's protection Poseidon surrounded her house with five concentric rings of water and land. He carved the rings with the ease and skill of a god. He made hot and cold springs come from the earth. With the development of a future city his descendants never lacked for water.

Cleito bore Poseidon ten sons, five sets of boys. Atlas the first son of the first set of twins, was made king over the vast territory by his father. His brothers were appointed princes and each ruled over a large section of the territory that was distributed to him. The most valuable section of the kingdom remained his mother's home on the hilltop and the land surrounding it. This was given to Atlas. Atlas himself had many sons with the succession of the throne always passing to the eldest son.

For generations Atlantis remained peaceful and prospered. Almost all of the population's needs were met from the island's mines, fields and forests. Anything that the kingdom did not produce was imported. This was possible because a channel was eventually built which transversed all the rings from the ocean to the center of the kingdom, or the acropolis. On this stood the royal palace near the original home of Poseidon and Cleito. Each succeeding king tried to out do his predecessor in building a greater kingdom. Finally the splendid city Metropolis and the outer city of Atlantis existed behind a great outer wall.

Poseidon sat down laws for Atlantis that the rulers were to fellow. The ruling body was to meet regularly. It was to consist of ten rulers that represented the first rulers -- Atlas and his nine brothers -- who reigned with absolute power of life and death over their subjects. These meeting occurred in the temple of Poseidon where the first rulers inscribed the laws on a pillar of orichalcum. First, as required by ancient ceremony, pledges were exchanged. Then a sacred bull was captured and killed. The body was burned as a sacrifice to the god. Then the blood was mixed with wine and poured over the fire as a act of purification for each man. The rulers were served wine in golden cups, each poured a libation over the fire and swore by oath to give judgment according to the inscribed laws. When ending his vow each drank his wine and dedicated his cup to the temple. This was followed by a dinner that preceded the rulers putting on magnificent blue robes in which they judged matters concerning the kingdom according to Poseidon's laws.

As long as they judged and lived by Poseidon's laws they and the kingdom prospered. When the laws began to be forgotten trouble began. More of the rulers eventually began marrying mortals and started acting like foolish humans. Soon pride overtook the rulers who soon began grasping for greater power. Then Zeus saw what had happened to the rulers. They had abandoned the laws of the gods and acted in an evil coalition as men. He assembled all the gods of Olympus around him and was to pronounce judgment on Atlantis. This is where Plato's story stops.

Whether Plato intended to end his story of Atlantis so abruptly or whether he intended to extend it no one knows. Just as no one knows whether Plato believed in the real existence of the island or whether it was purely a mythical kingdom. Many have said they believe that Plato believed in the island's existence because he exerted so much detail in its description, while others reject this by claiming since the story was purely fiction Plato could put in as much detail as he wanted, it does not prove a thing. Also in doubt is the time period of the story. Solon writes the island existed 9000 years before. This would place the time period in the Early Stone Age. In this period it is hard to imagine the type of agriculture, architecture and sea navigation as described in the story. One explanation for this time period inconsistency is that Solon misinterpreted the Egyptian symbol for "100" for "1000." If this be the case then Atlantis would have existed 900 years before. This would place the Atlantians in the Middle Bronze Age where they would possess the tools and equipment needed for the development described within the story.

To collaborate this 900 year theory there is geological evidence showing that roughly about 1500 BCE there was a gigantic volcanic eruption which caused half of the island to sink into the sea. Also a lost city has been said to have sunk in the Bay of Naples. At the time several rich and luxurious seaside resorts were located in the area. In the retelling of the story of Atlantis it is easy to see how one of these cities could be associated with it. The story is still being told which enthralls hundreds, as archaeological digs are conducted to unearth evidence of the real Atlantis. Until then the myth remains.

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PostSat Oct 05, 2013 6:44 pm » by Kinninigan


Egyptian, Atlantean, Greek, Judaic presence in the Western Hemisphere, 5000 years before Columbus

by Ed Z, Stamford, CT, and Johnny Ziomek (Los Angeles)

Copyright 2005 by Ed Z, Stamford, CT,
and Johnny Ziomek (Los Angeles)

Part 1: Egyptian roots of the geographical names of ancient locations
in the Western Hemisphere?

Part 2: Atlantean Puzzle Pieces (this page)

Part 3: Egyptian Images of Tehotu on the Temple of Teotu-Huacan

Personal Comments from Ed Ziomek

Part 2: Atlantean Puzzle Pieces

The following are plausible explanations and theories, leading us closer to the historical truths we all seek. I suspect 1000 authors or more have found these connections before me, in the last 500 years.

Atlantean Puzzle Pieces... my theory

As Critias explained to Plato, Atlantean names and landmarks are mentioned in the "Greek names", for a culture that preceded the Egyptian culture by an unknown quantity of centuries or millenia. While Critias claimed to know the original Atlantean names, he only referred to the Greek equivalent names, which followed the Egyptian equivalent names. No human being knows the exact Atlantean original names.

The Atlantean names may be nonexistent, and some say the legend is false. I disagree.

In my untrained, amateur, and yes its true... scholarly ignorance, I have found a concentration of Atlantean names and landmarks found in the Valley of Mexico, and they include the Aztec names with the "A-tee-lah" prefix:


Note: These names come from a $6 composite tourist map owned by the City of Mexico City, originally created in 1560 by Hector Elizalde Davalos, and modified in 1973 by Luis Aparicio with iconic symbolism from a book Antonio Penafiel, or so I am told.

I have spent the last two years finding remarkable coincidental Atlantean landmarks, embedded in the Aztecan naming conventions of this map. I would like to share these observations with you, first naming my discoveries and their connection to the Atlantean myth, then explaining them, point-by-point.

#1 on the Issues List, for Atlantis being hidden so long... "10 Miles from the Ocean"!

Critias explained to Plato, that Atlantis was an "island nation in the middle of the ocean (or 10 miles from the Ocean), surrounded by a ring of mountains." It is my untrained belief that this singular puzzling entry is the reason why the Valley of Mexico has been ignored for 2400 years, and Atlantis has remained hidden.

I believe that the correct translation of this comment by Critias, would be... that "Atlantis is an island nation, surrounded by a massive inland lake (Texcoco), and 10 miles from a second massive lake called Zhosheemilco."

Zhosheem, not "ocean". This Lake is spelled Xochimilco, and means "God of the Flowers", which alternately meant... a. God of fertility, b. warriors for sacrifice, and c. stars in the sky. There is a strong chance that this name was the Greek equivalent of Poseidon, and the Egyptian equivalent of Osiris, and is usually depicted "rising" out of the waters of the lake.

The two lake structures, Xochimilco and Texcoco, may have been manually connected via a massive excavation project just to the West of the "bent mountain", "Colhuacan". Several iconic images, identical to Egyptian images of the same function, point to this "canal" as the "Gateway to the Underworld" of Tenochtitlan.

Atlantean landmarks:

1. "10 miles from the Ocean". No. 10 miles from Xochimilco, Lake of the flowers.

2. Pillars of Hercules:
#1 candidate... Tepeyacac, Holy Hill, Phallic of the God 'Ea' "the Divine Male"
#2 candidate... Iliacac, Phallus of the God 'Ea' or "illiah" or 'a-yah'
#3 candidate... Colhuacan is this the Greek equivalent of "Colonus arraklees"
each candidate can also be described located where... "the straits were narrow at that point"

3. Temple of Athena
#1 Atenco Aten Inca, compare with Athens Greece... Temple of Athena-Nike
#2 Tenayucan.pu

4. Temple of Hephaestos Tepetacalco.pu, Epazoyucan, or Tepetzinco

5. Temple of Sun and Moon, Coatenchan Ka-Aten-Khan

6. "River Asopus on the left": Azcaputzalco.pu (west of Tepeyacac)

7. Temple of Atlas Atlaco

8. "Mt. Helicon", Chimal Huacan (my theory, compare with "Shamash Huacan")

9. Lycabettus and Penyx.
Lycabettus I believe is spelled incorrectly, but very close to a very recognizable name. Lycabettus I believe is the Aztec Bados, but labeled by the Conquistadors... Penon de los Bados, or "Pillar of the Bados". Why would the Conquistadors go through the trouble of mixing an Aztec title with a Spanish descriptive phrase. Based on all my research, and surrounding naming conventions, I believe the correct Aztec spelling of "Penon de los Bados" should be Yaca-Bados, or ill-ya-ka Bados, or Grave of the God, i.e, the Egyptian Abydos, (grave of Osiris). Penon de los Bados is located slightly to the East of Tenochtitlan, with ilicac (Phallus of the God, and Piller of Hercules candidate) place equidistant to the West of Tenochtitlan. Osiris was the God of the Underworld, God of the night. "Night-time" dies in the East, with the rising sun God, Horus-Ra. "Night-time" is born in the West, exactly where Horus-Ra dies at the setting sun, each day.

So I believe "ilicac", the phallus of the God, the piller of the God, or the "Penyx", is the "birthplace of Osiris", and Lycabettus, or Penon de los Bados, refers to the grave of Osiris.

Tenochtitlan is on the island in between these two landmarks. God of Darkness. My theory.

10. references to Poseidon, and Temple of Poseidon "Pochtli", "Papatlan"

The 3-pronged Saguarro Cactus is plausibly the Poseidon trident, which is part of the Mexican national flag.

11. references to Thoth, aka Tehotu, aka Djeheuty on left side of staircase of Teotuhuacan (Tehotu on temple of Teotu), also known as Hermes to the Greeks, Idris/Enoch to the Hebrews, Osiris to the Egyptians. Note the similarity: Tenochtitlan, and Enoch. Titlan, and Tuat land. i.e., "the Underworld" Tenochtitlan, "God of Darkness, land of the Tuat".

12. references to Osiris - Xochimilco, and Texcaca (She Ke Ku, Chicago) Lake of Osiris

Yahoo/Google lookup... Ka Ka +Osiris, or "Ka her Ka" +Osiris

13. "sandy soil with underlayment of clay"

Mexico City sinks 4 inches per year into the sandy soil, and Puebla, Mexico is renowned for its outstaning ceramic clays found there.

14. city location Thule "Tula, Mexico"

15. Nation location of Lemuria "The Maya".. could also be "Amiu-amau" group of Gods

16. "Land between the oceans was navigable", connections to the Atlantic and Pacific were river navigable, from the Valley of Mexico, in ancient times. Today's Mexico City sits "flat as a tabletop" at 7000 feet elevation. Tour guides will tell you that 4 cities lie buried in the Valley of Mexico, and the Aztecs did not know "who put them there".

17. Red rocks, black rocks, yellow rocks, white rocks, (from the Atlantean legend)

A geologist should be consulted on this, but these colors of rocks are present in the volcanic Valley of Mexico

18. Temple complex, surrounded by areas for craftsmen and warriors... The Temple complex of Teotuhuacan is surrounded by the remains of housing for the craftsmen, and close by to the town of "Otumba", which means "warriors" in at least one African dialect (Senegal, Congo?) The naming convention hints that specific tribes had the function of mercenary armies.

19. Atlantis sits at the end of a long promonotory... The entire country of present-day Mexico is shaped like a promonotory, ending in the Panama Canal area. But this "promonotory" reference by Critias is more immediatly shown in the geographic layout of the Valley of Mexico, in the Davalos map, with a "left arm" of land projecting from the "Atlicpac" area, westwards towards Colhuacan. The land area shown in the Davalos map may have extended northwards towards Tenochtitlan, but only island-mountaintops remain, surrounded by shallow lake waters. This coincides with the Critias description of what remained after the Atlantean "mud-flood", from Volcanic, rain inundations, or hurricane disruptions which scoured the agriculture hillsides of their topsoil in massive mudslides draining into the valley below. This raised the water levels of the lake structures in the valley, and left the area a "skeleton of its previous self" (paraphrased). I believe the legends match the facts of the Valley of Mexico.

20. Atlantis is located at the "navel of the earth" Atlantis

Ombligo (navel to Mexicans), and Vulva to the Aztecs. The name Atlantis can be translated almost entirely from the Egyptian. "AT" as a prefix, is a remarkable two-letter set, with two meanings: Vulva, and Rebel (girly man).

On the female side, the Goddess side, AT means "vulva", the goddess of creation, the womb of creation. Atlantis literally means... Land of creation, very close to "navel of the earth".

On the Male side, the "AT" prefix is an insult. Atlas, you remember, was a Titan God who rebelled against Hercules, the Olympian. At-las means... "rebel", or "girly man". I think this insulting naming convention, which survives today, is a warning... "Defy the Olympians, and we will mock your name for all eternity."

Citizens of Mexico today have been taught that the Valley of Mexico is called... "Ombligo", the "belly button of the Moon".

21. Atlantis sits at the center of an "truly endless continent", as does the Valley of Mexico. In fact, the Valley of Mexico is the physical beginning of the entire North American continent, and on top of the South American continent. It is one good reason that I believe the Atlas statue is in fact a secret map of the Western Hemisphere. The head of Atlas is arguably "Yucatan", with right arm being Florida/Cuba, and left arm being Baja. The Valley of Mexico sits on the left shoulder of the Atlas statue, and is the beginning of "a truly endless continent".

22. Critias speaks of 10 double-temples, and I have found 9 in the Valley of Mexico, with a possible 10th. I have not translated them, for their meanings, but let me present them to you. There is also the added concern that the dates of their construction is unknown, some attributing them to the Aztecs, who organized in modern times, post 1325 AD. I don't know, I may be entirely wrong on this, but there are 9 of the 10 double temples in the Valley of Mexico, and their names are:

Atzacoalco, or Atlacoalco
Huitznahuac this temple is depicted with two aspects, of a single temple structure. Is this the missing 10th double temple? (still studying this one)

23. Acropolis On the Davalos map, in the exact vicinity of Penon de los Bados, or what I refer to as the "Lycabettus" candidate is a place name of "Acopulco" or "Acopuco". I believe this is the Acropolis, which has a directly Greek meaning.

By the way, my translation theories are evolving on a daily basis, and I now may have a second opinion on the pronunciation of "Iliacac". It may not be... "eel- lee-ya cock", but instead may be "il-lee-sus", which also is mentioned in the Atlantean myth.

The main area of the Valley of Mexico, as depicted in the Davalos map.

Issues... Not a Perfect Discourse...of course!

Critias may have embellished the truth. He speaks to Plato of Zeus in his temple, with a magnificent chariot. As I understood history, horses were not domesticated until 3500 BC or so, with chariots not being available until 1700 BC.

Critias also spoke of elephants and domesticated cattle and such things, not evident in the Western Hemisphere. However, in the early 1900s, there was some serious speculation that elephants existed in the Americas long ago, as did horses which were used for food.

So, the mystery continues. What have I discovered?

I say nothing. I say the Conquistadors KNEW all of this. They recognized the "pagan" Egyptian and Greek and Atlantean symbolism, and they tried to destroy all of it.

1000 or 10,000 authors before me have written these words, or similar words. My contribution is that I am researching library books, and finding numerous authors who have made truly significant discoveries, and presenting these puzzle pieces, seeing a possible connection.

I am reminded what Graham Hancock wrote in 1994 (paraphrased), Fingerprints of the Gods..."The animal God images found on the Western wall of Teotuhuacan are identical to the animal God images of Egypt."

Ed Z, Stamford, CT, and Johnny Ziomek (Los Angeles)


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PostSat Oct 05, 2013 6:57 pm » by Kinninigan


The Legend of Atlantis [Complete 5-Part Series]

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Published on Mar 1, 2013

▲ Part 1: Dawn of the Gods ▲
"Thousands of years ago the gods came down to Earth from the stars to initiate a genesis. Human civilization was formed and reached a peak with Atlantis. A Dark Age began and the battle of Atlantean gods led to its fall. A secret brotherhood brought Atlantean secret teachings before the fall to Egypt. Through all civilizations and with inspiration from extraterrestrian guards the secret Atlantean brotherhood managed all political systems with an educational mission. The thrilling documentation shows for the first time the secret activities of a brotherhood in relations with invisible masters from Shambhala and Agharta and the secret about the hollow earth.

▲ Part 2: The Secret Brotherhood of Atlantis▲
"Following the catastrophe in Atlantis all nations were dispersed. A part of the Atlantean brotherhood's secret knowledge survived in Egypt, in India and in Tibet. The heirs of these secret brotherhoods led mankind during the Dark Age...through Atlantean knowledge and through all ages. In modern times the Freemasons, Templars and Illuminati brotherhoods were formed. After World War I the Neutemplerorden and Thule society emerged in Munich and Vienna. New occult sects which saw 'satan' in the old Freemason lodges. With Hitler these occult sects came to power. This thrilling documentation shows for the first time the background of the Third Reich and its intellect which led to the catastrophe of World War II.

▲ Part 3: The Secret Prophecies of the Apocalypse▲
"Atlantean secret knowledge tells us the legend of mankind and those souls, who have to undergo cycles. With the fall of Atlantis a gigh civilization cycle had ended. All prophecies and more recent Earth changes point out that today's mankind has reached the end of the next experience cycle. Up to the year 2012 the most serious Earth and climate changes, earthquakes, social and political changes have been predicted. This thrilling documentation shows the prophecies of ELIA, the returned prophet and his message on the last days, Christ's return and the space Brotherhood.

▲ Part 4: The Return of the Lightmasters from Atlantis▲
"Millenniums have passed... since the high culture of Atlantis sank with a catastrophe through power abuse of some corrupt scientists. All humans of that time, who also experienced the descent into the Dark Age, are being reincarnated today. The thrilling documentation shows the return of the Atlantean light children and allows deep insight into the role of the lightworkers and brotherhoods of Atlantis. It shows why some souls reincarnate today and act as environmental protectionists, therapists, artists, esoterics etc. for the healing of the earth. Addresses also the Space Brotherhood events--11.11, the hollow earth, Shambhala and Agharta.

▲ Part 5: The War of Armageddon▲
"For millenniums the secrets of creation were exclusively limited to an elite of secret societies. Now we have entered the so-called \"Last Days\" where these secret societies like the Freemasons and the secret political lodges lose their power. This exciting video documentation will reveal the Atlantean secret knowledge on the hollow world and their extraterrestrian civilizations. The secret of the pyramids, the Sphinx, world-wide underground tunnel systems, flight movement of the Nazis to the South Pole and much more allow the viewer to obtain an overview over the final secrets of the past and its connection with extraterrestrials.

A Mirrored video by Lamplight Group

Lamplight Group Official Website

Mad Latino Studio's Official Website

***this video is not neccesarily the opinion or views of the Lamplight Group and is shared only for information purposes***



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