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What the Mayans Have to Say

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PostTue Mar 13, 2012 8:44 am » by Fatdogmendoza

cornbread714 wrote:
noentry wrote:I also read somewhere they had a prediction for the end of their civilization.
Something about when the red beards arrived it would be the end of their nation. :headscratch:

There were a lot of those kinds of predictions among tribes throughout the Americas.

In Bolivia, there was a mountaintop (Potosi) that was basically pure silver. The locals had mined the silver in relatively small amounts for ages, making masks and other items.

Legend has it that about 50 years before the Spaniards showed up, a "voice" came out of the mountain telling the people that they should no longer mine the silver - it belonged to someone else.

When the Spaniards got there, they slowly leveled the mountain, which produced an enormous amount of silver - enough to create a currency that created Europe's economy (but that's a whole other story...).

It's also estimated that hundreds of thousands of slaves (mostly Africans) died in the mines there before all the silver was taken.

EDIT - I looked up the facts and I was partly wrong in my recollections of what I had read. Apparently MILLIONS of Indians died in mining the mountain and the number of Africans was much lower.

History echoes in the mines of Potosi

The miner squints into my headlamp, the shadow of his grotesquely swollen cheek looming along the rock surface behind him.

Coca leaves are packed so tightly into his left cheek that he has to speak awkwardly with the other side of his mouth.

I glimpse teeth blackened by tobacco and coca as he talks. Both products ward off hunger, allowing the miners to work a full day without having to stop to eat.

"My name is Rene," he says. "I'm the oldest man in this mine. I'm now 57, and I've been working here for 40 years."

Rene and his small band of workmates are among the 8,000 miners who scratch a living from inside the bowels of the Cerro Rico hill in the Bolivian highlands.

The hill, now honeycombed with mines, no longer yields much for the miners - among them an estimated 1,000 children between eight and 12-years-old - who work it today. Despite four decades of backbreaking work, Rene still cannot afford to retire.Image

But its past is one of almost unimaginable riches.

The hill was largely untouched when Spanish conquistadores stumbled across it in 1544.

I am rich Potosi,
Treasure of the world.
The king of all mountains,
And the envy of all kings
Legend on 16th-century Potosi coat of arms

Over the next three centuries, it yielded a river of riches - more than 62,000 metric tonnes (137 million pounds) of silver that provided the Spanish aristocracy with a lifestyle of profligate opulence and, because it was used to pay off many Spanish debts to neighbours, fuelled much of the economic rise of Europe.

Much of the silver even ended up in China - used to pay for England's new addiction to tea.

Potosi, the city which grew up at the foot of the hill, was said to be paved with silver and became a byword for luxury and splendour. At the height of its splendour in the 17th Century, Potosi was one of the largest cities in the world.

But Spain's unquenchable thirst for silver had a terrible human cost. The African and native Indian slaves ordered into the mines are said to have survived, on average, six months.

View of Cerro Rico from Potosi
The cone of Cerro Rico rises above Potosi's cobbled streets
ImageIt is estimated as many as eight million men may have died - from mining accidents, lung diseases caused by the mineral dust, and contamination by the mercury used in processing the silver.

These days, there is a wistful, threadbare feel about the cobbled streets of Potosi, where from almost any spot the perfect cone of Cerro Rico rises in the distance. The faded houses have lost the gilded ornamentation they once had. Some have been saved from total collapse with heritage grants from the old colonial master, Spain.

The locals - mainly Quechua-speaking Indians - complain that their rivers have been polluted by the metal factories.

It feels as though the improvement in conditions since the colonial days down the mines can have been only slight. The miners now work in small private co-operatives. They are no longer slaves, but there is little other choice of work in this remote stretch of the Andes.

El Tio, the miners' devil god
The miners make offerings to their devil god - in the shape of a white manImage
The lack of investment means there are few local smelting factories to process the metals extracted from Cerro Rico - these days, low-grade silver and zinc - ready for industrial use. Ironically, the zinc sheets used to roof the basic housing around the mountain are imported from Europe.

In the small cavern at the end of one of the mining tunnels, Rene methodically shovels rock debris into a large rubber container, his cheek still swollen with coca leaves.

In these cramped tunnels, the heat reaches 40C. This makes it too uncomfortable for the miners to wear face masks that might protect their lungs from the air, which is acrid with metallic-tasting dust.

Bitter taste

Prolonged exposure to this dust is what gives the average miner a life expectancy of only 40 years - and why Rene's longevity is hailed by his workmates.

Miners shovel the rock
It is hot, dusty, backbreaking work
They contract what they call the mal de mina, the lung disease silicosis.Image

"After so many years working, I really want to retire," says Rene, as he waits for the rubber basket, now full, to be winched up a shaft.

"I've been diagnosed with 30% silicosis of the lungs. But we only receive the miner's pension from the government when we have 80% or 90% silicosis of the lungs."

This leaves Rene in a bitter quandary. He is longing to retire, but when he finally can, he knows he will have only months to live.

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PostTue Mar 13, 2012 11:48 am » by Rich316

Interesting stuff guys! From what I understood, they moved into other areas because of drought.. but the spaniards would have certainly made them move too.. Probably a combination of things like drought and spanish invasion.

We would know so much more about them, their calendars, if only the spanish stayed home and minded their fucking business. A culture, an era, a society of highly advanced time keepers, all ruined by greedy ignorant bastards.. woeful.

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PostTue Mar 13, 2012 11:54 am » by Svaha

Thanks for the doc Cornbread :flop:

The western view on these ancient cultures is complete wrong because it's based on a western perspective (male, based on scarcety, no connection with mother earth / life, no authonomy)
That's why even today we destroy local communities, put people into non sustaining cities (that they left a long time ago for just that reason)
What we don't see is that we also 'destroy' the earth / life, stop natural cycles.
Unlike the people that can be murdered and / or removed by force, nature will kill 'us'.
Follow your bliss(ters) - Joseph Campbell

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PostTue Mar 13, 2012 4:31 pm » by Truthdefender

hackjames wrote:Without having investigated in any capacity, I wonder about the authenticity of some of the most brutal practices attributed to the Maya. I have my reasons for suspicion, but I'm curious if anyone could either validate or invalidate my opinion for me?

Don't make me type things when you could type things instead, please.

Human Sacrifice Found in Maya City Sinkhole

The bones of six humans—including two children—jade beads, shells, and stone tools are among the Maya "treasures" recently found in a water-filled cave off a sinkhole at the famous archaeological site of Chichén Itzá (picture) in Mexico, archaeologists say.

The ancient objects are most likely related to a ritual human sacrifice during a time when water levels were lower, sometime between A.D. 850 and 1250, the researchers say. ... co-cenote/

The common method for human sacrifice seems to have been for the "ah nacom" (a functionary) to extract the heart quickly, while 4 people associated with Chac, the rain/lightning god, held the struggling victim's limbs. Human sacrifices seem to have been made, as well, with arrows, by flaying, decapitation, hurling from a precipice, and throwing the victim into a limestone sinkhole. ... aScrfc.htm
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PostWed Mar 14, 2012 2:20 am » by Abdul14


During an analysis of some low frequency radio wave images coming from the center of our Milky Way galaxy, which were received by the Very Large Array radio telescope at Socorro, New Mexico in 2002, researchers discovered a quite extraordinary intermittent signal, that seemed to be intelligently directed, which consisted of five highly energetic radio emissions of equal brightness that lasted 10 minutes each and appeared every 77 minutes over about a 7-hour period from September 30 to October 1 of that year.

Our modern day astrophysicists and astronomers, with all their sophisticated scientific instruments, are not the only humans that have wondered what may exist at the center of our galaxy. The superb astronomers and mathematicians of the ancient Mayan civilization, also pondered this question. The Mayans knew where in the sky the exact center of the galaxy was located and they even had a glyph representing it which is now named Hunab Ku ; it was known to the Mayans as The Galactic Butterfly. Their entire cosmology and extremely accurate calendars were based on the existence and location of Hunab Ku and they deeply believed that the future of mankind ultimately depends on what occurs there.

Hunab Ku was, to the Mayans, the supreme God and ultimate Creator and was located in the center of the Milky Way galaxy. It represented the gateway to other galaxies beyond our Sun as well as all of the consciousness that has ever existed in this, our own galaxy. Hunab Ku, according to the Mayans, is also the consciousness which organized all matter from a whirling disk – into stars, planets and solar systems. Hunab Ku is the Mother Womb which is constantly giving birth to new stars and it gave birth to our own Sun and planet Earth as well as the other planets found in our solar system. They also believed that the ultimate Creator directs everything that happens in our galaxy from its center through the emanation of periodic energy bursts of consciousness.

Today, modern astronomers have indeed verified that at the center of our Milky Way galaxy is found a “whirling disk” with a “black hole” at its center that is both swallowing and giving birth to stars. Could the extraordinary low frequency radio wave images discovered coming from the center of our Milky Way galaxy be programmed bursts of energy consciousness coming from the ultimate Creator… and actually be a modern manifestation of what the ancient Mayans believed?

There does appear to be a growing convergence taking place with regard to what the ancient Mayans believed and understood and what our modern scientists and quantum physicists are increasingly discovering about our galaxy today.

One big difference is how modern physicists view and how the ancient Mayas viewed time. Today, physicists view time as being linear. In contrast, the Mayas believed essentially that time flows in a circle. There is a beginning and an end to things but there is a renewal at the end of the Time Cycle. There is a periodicity with regard to all manifested phenomena. The Mayan highly accurate Long Count Calendar is based on this precept. The Mayans also believed that time originates out of the Hunab Ku and is controlled by it.

It is very difficult to dismiss the Mayan Cosmology because they left extraordinary evidence behind which verifies that their time-keeping methodologies gave extremely accurate results and, in spite of the various changes in our own calendar systems of the more recent past, still do. The ancient Mayan astronomers accurately predicted, over 1500 years ago, the exact alignment of the Earth, the Sun, the star cluster Pleiades with the center of our galaxy that will take place at the end of the present long cycle during the coming Gregorian year of 2012.

On the Mayan Long Calendar the day designated as 4 Ahau 3 Kankin ( falls on December 21, 2012 and this day will mark “El Fin de los Tiempos” or the end of the long cycle when all of humanity will experience a new beginning, and on this day, according to the Mayans and subsequent Meso-American civilizations, the return of Kukulcan also known as Quetzalcoatl will take place.

The pyramids of the Mayan civilization, like the one at Chichen-Itza in Mexico, are precisely aligned to mark the yearly Solstices and the Equinoxes that are caused by the precession of the Earth’s axis as it orbits the Sun. The Pyramid of Kukulcan at Chichen-Itza is essentially a superb and highly accurate time-keeping device that never fails to mark the yearly Precession of the Equinoxes.

On December 21, 2012, which coincides with the Winter Solstice in the Northern Hemisphere, a unique event will occur. As the Sun sets west of Chichen-Itza, a pattern of shadow and light will project an image of the Plumed Serpent Quetzalcoatl descending the stairs of that pyramid which also has a large head of a serpent sculpted in stone at its base. This occurs twice at Chichen Itza every year but on the Winter Solstice of December 21, 2012 something very unique and special will happen.

As the Sun sets in the early afternoon of that day, the shadow of the pyramid’s northwest edge will project a moving pattern of light that joins and illuminates the sculpted serpent head at the base of the stairway. Within a thirty-four minute period, the serpent, formed by this play of light and shadow will appear to descend to the Earth, as the sun leaves each stair, going from the top to the bottom. This combined effect creates the visual appearance of the body of the serpent descending the pyramid steps.

Also, on December 21, 2012, the tail of the serpent when projected up from the top of the pyramid will be pointing precisely to the star cluster known as the Pleiades. Finally, on December 21, 2012 at around 11:11 universal time, there will be a precise alignment of our Sun with the galactic center or Hunab Ku. (The pyramids at Teotihuacán which means “City of the Gods,” constructed by a Meso-American civilization just north of Mexico City that preceded the Mayas, are also aligned to the Pleiades as are the Egyptian pyramids at Giza).

Quetzalcoatl is arguably the most famous of all of the gods of the New World. No other figure has stirred modern imagination nearly as much, and the history of the interest in this particular mythic figure dates to a time very early after the contact between native inhabitants and the conquering Spaniards in Central Mexico.

The name is a Nahuatl word composed of two separate words joined together; quetzal – the quetzal bird of Guatemala is known for very long green tail feathers that were highly prized – and coatl – serpent. The simplest definition might then be quetzal-bird serpent but the usual modern translation is feathered serpent.

Quetzalcoatl is related to many names and incarnations, and seems to play a prominent role in a pantheon of virtually all the other Mesoamerican deities since he himself is also known as Gukumatz, Nine Wind, and Kukulcan among others as well as being found in the astronomical and cosmological associations among the heavens and stars. These ancient connections include the morning star, which is the planet Venus, as well as the possibility of a connection with the planet Mercury, the messenger.

Ultimately this strong symbolism that runs through the mythology and the various astrological and cosmological incarnations is the thing which in our present time gives us undeniable and very tangible hints of Quetzalcoatl’s great ancient power and reveals his ultimate pervasiveness which is evident in the scholarly research of the remaining cultural treasures that the ancient Mayan people left for posterity.

Perhaps this ancient Quetzalcoatl spiritual mythology is eternal and will now return once again to its prominence as a result of the cosmic forces so recently detected as strongly flowing from the Hunab Ku. It may then become a new and modern cosmomythoconsciousness in the same way that the return of the Christ-Messiah is awaited by those who believe in that version of the cosmomythoconsciousness.

Quantum theory strongly hints at the possibility that what we take for our reality is actually composed of a reality that is totally vibrational in character; simply an illusion which makes our lives seem logical and livable in a practical everyday manner.

Perhaps the recent signals from the galactic center are a cosmic vibrational code, sent from the Creator to change our very human nature by restructuring our DNA… sent out in order to modify and increase our present understanding of the quantum universe we inhabit and, through this process of change, put us on a new, yet altogether ancient spiritual path that is but the completion of an ongoing evolutionary cycle and a cyclic return to its very beginning just as the Mayan Calendar seems to foretell.

Just as our subconscious may be comprised of perhaps 90% of our “overall consciousness,” and it is therefore vastly important and useful in living our lives, so too is the possibility that the 90% of our DNA which is labeled as “junk” is also quite important and useful. There may be unique, as yet undiscovered parallels between these two systems.

In fact, there has been some discussion about how that 90% of our DNA may actually interface with a fifth, as yet unseen dimension. Perhaps it is performing tasks that are not yet readily identifiable because of the limitations in our present ability to understand the physics involved.

It has been proposed by some scientific thinkers that the junk DNA is in fact a master cylinder, so to speak, that runs the rest of the DNA and tells it what to do, instructs it how to perform. In this way it would operate much like the subconscious, or perhaps the superconscious, in interfacing with a reality which we cannot yet distinguish in our “day to day” world.

Just as the subconscious can supposedly access the Akashic Records, or at least obtain non local information in a non local fashion, so perhaps can our junk DNA actively function through contact in some fashion with an as yet unrecognized galactic exchange of consciousness information.

In fact it might be part and parcel in a sense of the subconscious mind. If we could scientifically understand that the physical world is not made up of elementary particles, as is now thought, but of elementary units of consciousness, then this mystery might become a bit more understandable.

Exactly what may happen on December 21, 2012 still remains a mystery but it seems we might be receiving stronger and stronger clues. Obviously the Mayans certainly attached great significance to this date and foresaw a great cyclic change… both an ending and a new beginning.

Although still some 7 years away, mankind is already experiencing some unwelcome physical changes in the Earth itself. The number and magnitude of “natural” catastrophes are increasing. Scientists have also detected extreme and erratic behavior in our Sun that in turn is having strong effects on our Earth’s atmosphere and are also finding measurable effects on the other planets in our solar system as well.

Could the strange, intelligent signals emanating from the center of our galaxy, the Hunab Ku, be a cause of the weather and other changes we are experiencing here on Earth today? Will these intelligent, energetic bursts of consciousness from Hunab Ku increase in number and intensity as we approach the year 2012? Are they of an ancient cosmic spiritual nature, setting the stage for the change to a new cosmic paradigm in our Milky Way Galaxy? I believe that the ancient Mayan cosmologists would most likely answer in the affirmative… Yes indeed – change is coming very soon.

The Mayan cosmologists said that mankind will enter a new beginning… a new era of heightened consciousness beginning on December 21, 2012, when the present 5,125 period of their calendar ends. Perhaps, a colossal emission of a yet unrecognized form of conscious energy will burst out of our Galactic Center on or before December 21, 2012…. a returning Quetzalcoatl consciousness which will change the very physics of our present world paradigm, bringing mankind and our galaxy a new quantum leap in physics and a new spiritual paradigm that will last until the cycle repeats and the cosmic consciousness of mythic time itself comes full circle once again. ... mayan.html
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PostWed Mar 14, 2012 2:44 am » by Slith

Great post Abbi. This would have been a great add-on to CB's Mayan post. Would u mind if I put it there?

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PostWed Mar 14, 2012 2:53 am » by Abdul14

i dont mind 8-) you gotta link to cb's thread?
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PostWed Mar 14, 2012 2:57 am » by Slith

abdul14 wrote:i dont mind 8-) you gotta link to cb's thread?


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PostWed Mar 14, 2012 3:26 am » by G3n3sis

I find it interesting that there appears to be a division in perspectives of Mayan history. After viewing the so-called evidence for contact with extra-terrestrials (artifacts etc.) I cant help but wonder if this is all a set-up. The recently discovered artifacts, featuring people who look exactly like grey aliens, I mean this opens up a whole new can of worms. Will this give credit to the abduction phenomenon and a torrent of biblical hysteria? After reading Helmut Lammers book "MILABS", I'm seeing the whole masonic, doomsday, alien-contact set-up as a textbook game plan and there playing it step by step. As the world becomes nuttier, Im finding it increasingly difficult to find any sanity and credence to this mess. :think:
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