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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 1:15 pm » by Slith


Rydher wrote:So did any DTV member see any brutality this weekend? I searched the forums and was unable to ever see any DTV member actually see anything themselves - ever. Which leads someone to a few conclusions. Either DTV members don't really exist. They exist and see this stuff, but are too afraid to post it. DTV members must live in all the 'not normal' locales for police brutality and it's happening everywhere else except where we live. Or it's no different now than it always has been.

I mean come on, use your heads. A small group of people can claim anything, go out and film that "situation" exclusively. It would appear what ever it is they were claiming was happening all the time. I'm not saying there isn't law enforcement corruption or abuse. Heck, it's been happening since biblical times. Just look at Matthew 28:12-15 where the Jewish priests bribed the guards.

It's not the majority of them, it's not the norm, and it's not 40% of them. Stop dehumanizing these people and remember they are no different than you and I. Some are corrupt but most are not.

All of us have seen this stuff Rydher, maybe not this last weekend, and maybe when we saw it we didn't have cam in hand. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. I respect the law, but the good they do doesn't sell newspapers. Unfortunately.
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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 1:27 pm » by Rydher


dlslith wrote:All of us have seen this stuff Rydher, maybe not this last weekend, and maybe when we saw it we didn't have cam in hand. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. I respect the law, but the good they do doesn't sell newspapers. Unfortunately.


I understand that. I'm using the absurdity of my conclusions to highlight the absurdity of what's being presented here. But just because you happen to see a cop smacking someone with their nightstick or tasing someone at a club, doesn't make it brutality. I've noticed a lot of these videos that are posted here are only snap shots of the situation and wrong conclusions can easily be made about the situation.

Like if two guys were fighting, one of their girlfriends tries to break it up. The guy whose girlfriend it isn't knocks her down. He takes off leaving the guys girlfriend standing over her with bloody knuckles and someone snapping a picture from that point. People would obviously conclude that the guy with the bloody knuckles, standing over the girl is the one who knocked her down. You see this stuff happen all the time. Like that one picture/video of the cop "running over" a OWS protester with his bike.

From my personal prospective. I have never seen a cop do anything that wasn't warranted. I also drive all day, every day for work. I see 25 -50 cops a day, not once have I seen anything that could be remotely viewed as brutality.


Edit: I think Hawk said he was in Chicago? I can understand the different viewpoint. Chicago is notorious for corruption, especially within it's law enforcement.

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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 1:41 pm » by Slith


Rydher wrote:
dlslith wrote:All of us have seen this stuff Rydher, maybe not this last weekend, and maybe when we saw it we didn't have cam in hand. Doesn't mean it didn't happen. I respect the law, but the good they do doesn't sell newspapers. Unfortunately.


I understand that. I'm using the absurdity of my conclusions to highlight the absurdity of what's being presented here. But just because you happen to see a cop smacking someone with their nightstick or tasing someone at a club, doesn't make it brutality. I've noticed a lot of these videos that are posted here are only snap shots of the situation and wrong conclusions can easily be made about the situation.

Like if two guys were fighting, one of their girlfriends tries to break it up. The guy whose girlfriend it isn't knocks her down. He takes off leaving the guys girlfriend standing over her with bloody knuckles and someone snapping a picture from that point. People would obviously conclude that the guy with the bloody knuckles, standing over the girl is the one who knocked her down. You see this stuff happen all the time. Like that one picture/video of the cop "running over" a OWS protester with his bike.

From my personal prospective. I have never seen a cop do anything that wasn't warranted. I also drive all day, every day for work. I see 25 -50 cops a day, not once have I seen anything that could be remotely viewed as brutality.


Edit: I think Hawk said he was in Chicago? I can understand the different viewpoint. Chicago is notorious for corruption, especially within it's law enforcement.

Fair point. I remember this distinctly. Not saying this is brutality, but it is abuse of power. How do I know? Cause I was there and saw this first hand. Ottawa, Canada Day 2010. This guy was guilty by association. He did nothing wrong. Now, keep in mind my previous point. Good news doesn't sell. The amount of good that was done by the police on that day wasn't even recognised by the media, but this was. One incident can corrupt the mindset of many. Yes, they get a bad rap. Most are honest and legit. They get no fanfare


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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 2:29 pm » by The57ironman


3d. Trolling: Trolling is strictly disallowed. We define a 'troll' as someone who's purpose on the site is to create as much disruption as possible, offend as many people as possible or otherwise cause disruption intentionally for personal amusement. Behaviour that can be defined as "trolling" generally involves the posting of knowingly false or offensive comments or views designed to provoke, bait and annoy other members.










Rydher wrote:So everyone. How may cops did you see beating people today? Ya know, since it is the norm. Maybe if you didn't see any beatings, hey it's possible. Did anyone you know see cops beating anyone down today?

Someone had to see something somewhere, right? Because this shit is out of control.










Rydher wrote:So did any DTV member see any brutality this weekend? I searched the forums and was unable to ever see any DTV member actually seeing anything themselves - ever. Which leads someone to a few conclusions. Either DTV members don't really exist. They exist and see this stuff, but are too afraid to post it. DTV members must live in all the 'not normal' locales for police brutality and it's happening everywhere else except where we live. Or it's no different now than it always has been.

I mean come on, use your heads. A small group of people can claim anything, go out and film that "situation" exclusively. It would appear what ever it is they were claiming was happening all the time. I'm not saying there isn't law enforcement corruption or abuse. Heck, it's been happening since biblical times. Just look at Matthew 28:12-15 where the Jewish priests bribed the guards.

It's not the majority of them, it's not the norm, and it's not 40% of them. Stop dehumanizing these people and remember they are no different than you and I. Some are corrupt but most are not.










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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 3:57 pm » by Rydher


Hey look, another great contribution by Ironman. Use the report function next time.

Seriously though if a mod needs to look at anything, it's Ironman's formatting technique of creating a 1/2 page of dead space in his posts. So that it takes up 1/2 page of the thread, burying any conversations or points made.
Last edited by Rydher on Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 4:08 pm » by The57ironman


.


.....do you even ''know'' where you stand..?


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Rydher wrote:MS, I have never once denied that police misconduct happens. There are bad cops out there, but there is a concentrated effort to push these types of stories out that do nothing but demonize the police. Don't take everything at face value and damn sure don't be so easily swayed by google search results. Because if that were the case

Police Brutality
About 6,850,000 results (0.13 seconds)

Police Kindness
About 13,500,000 results (0.06 seconds)


cops-just-love-those-tasers-t54374-10.html




no-right-to-resist-illegal-cop-entry-into-home-t51471.html


man-jailed-for-making-a-fake-video-of-inappropriate-behavior-t49301.html



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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 4:12 pm » by Slith


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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 4:13 pm » by Rydher


I'm not sure what you are trying to prove but you're doing nothing but showcasing the fact that I've always held the same opinion and am a beacon of consistency and fairness.

What is the deal with your periods, stretchering out your posts and filling them with blank space?

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PostMon Jun 04, 2012 11:57 pm » by Noentry


@rydher

Nobody is denying the majority of police do a good job.
The problem is the way the corrupt police are given immunity to the letter of the law rydher.
This post has nothing to do with good cops and every thing to do with corrupt cops.
It is never, the good that people do that is highlighted, because that is expected from all.
It is the bad that is of importance here.
I do understand your stance of police are needed in today's society. This is without question.

What is of importance is the protection these corrupt officers are given. This alienates the common man, breeds distrust and segregation.
And because corrupt police are given this immunity to follow the letter of the law they are destroying the spirit of the law.

I myself have been a victim of such corruption. Once only but the policeman in question was not prosecuted for his crimes. This abuse of power, makes the job of the good cops impossible.

The fact of life is this you can do a thousand good things, but if you do one bad you will be remembered for this. This is how it should be.

And if one bad cop is protected to save the face of the good then in the end we all lose.
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The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority.
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PostTue Jun 05, 2012 6:22 am » by Iwanci


Hey Noentry, as you know my friend I am a fairly level headed poster.

There is nothing wrong with your statement nor the fact that anyone in this thread has issues with ‘bad cops’. I, personally have had some minor altercations with an overzealous constabulary, however nothing to complain about. I think that whilst we have a judicial system we need to entrust that it is looking out for the rights of the common man. Cases of injustice are common in every level of society and do not have any greater or lesser meaning when it comes to the police.

Sure we all want to see justice served to every member of society who abuses their power or takes advantage of another person, and for this reason we all need to be vigilant and raise these concerns publicly, sometimes the public outcry gets heard... the squeaky wheel gets the most oil.

However, my concern with topics that tend to generalise like this one, is that in all the bravado and with all the good intentions, we invite comment from people who are clearly biased in their views, either way mind you. I know people who have a hatred for police members, and no amount of righteousness nor good deed will ever alter their minds. We just need to present a balanced view of the police force rather than a bash fest which often ensues fuelling already one sided debates.

My bent on this topic is simple. I believe that police are conditioned from the day they enter the force to deal and behave in certain ways, this conditioning changes them, I know this for a fact, and it is a requirement that they are inducted in a certain way, self preservation is drummed into their heads and they are told it is a ‘me or them’ situation ALL the times. It is a war, literally and new members are mad to believe this with good reason. There are cases of kind hearted police officers being assaulted and even killed due to their naivety.
I believe where there are cases of brutality or corruption these cases need to be aired publicly and the lynch mob should ensue, why not? But to denigrate honest members due to the selfish acts of a few rotten people is wrong. The acts depicted in most videos are shown without ANY context. This in itself is wrong. Imagine you see a video of a policeman beating a person, the outrage. Then we hear that the events that led to this point justified the situation (whatever that would be), it paints a different perspective.

I guess all I am saying (in my usual long winded style) is that everything needs to be put into context. Most boys grow up wanting to be policemen, they do this because they have good intent, not because they want to be corrupt or power hungry....we start from there.
:flop:
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